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Thread: amunation box

  1. #21
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
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    Near Gettysburg PA
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    119

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    Interesting topic. First I might mention that a one inch thick board can be created by either gluing a 1/4" board to a 3/4" board or glue two thicker boards together and run them through a planer or joiner. For those without those tools the first option is the most easily accomplished.

    Second, I am confused about which type of ammunition box we are talking about. The Ordnance Manual is a challenge to say the least. I can find where it describes boxes to "bundle cartridges" (Ordnance Manual 1863, page 255) and "Packing Musket Balls" (1863 page 256), and packing box dimensions "Cartridges for Small Arms" (1863, page 257) where box size and color of boxes change according to what is in them.

    Thank you in advance for your assistance in helping me to understand,
    Dave E.
    David Einhorn, Author of the book titled, "Civil War Blacksmithing" available from Amazon.com http://www.amazon.com/Civil-War-Blac...+blacksmithing

  2. #22
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    28

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    Thank you everybody for the information this should give me an idea of how to construct it but what type of color of paint should i use for a 58.cal menniball with 80 grains and a munition depo in ohio?
    Jimmy

  3. #23
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    28

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    tell me what you guys think about this is it correct?
    http://www.2ncmi.org/AmmoBoxArticle.pdf

  4. #24
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Central Va
    Posts
    250

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    Dave
    .. based on research Ive done on arsenal records and returns in the national archives... The projectile casting/pressing, cartridge making, and packaging were separate processes at most armory/arsenal facilities. Hense may encounter boxing/packaging items that were used between processes..

    "packing musket balls" was typically used in packing the newly cast/pressed lead projectiles, forwarded to the cartridge rolling facility for further processing. These were usually internal use at the arsenal or between facilities if the casting and rolling processes were done at different locations. "bundle cartridges" likewise was usually the result of the rolled up loose cartridges... defined verbage used thereof in different arsenals may vary.. Then were normally bundled in tens and packaged in the "Cartridges - Small arms" packing boxes that were the finished packaged product ready for distribution to the field. This is the box that would be most commonly found out in the field.
    Lieut Frederick Sineth
    14th Virginia Infantry Regt Co.I
    - 106th Penna Vol Co.F

    - Pegrams Va Artillery
    - 150th Sailors Creek

  5. #25

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    Hallo!

    "Thank you everybody for the information this should give me an idea of how to construct it but what type of color of paint should i use for a 58.cal menniball with 80 grains and a munition depo in ohio?"

    The 1861 Ordnance Manual called for "Olive" to be the color for .58 expanding ball "packing boxes." Even though "olive" is more of a concept than an actual universal color chip, based on how exacting lads mixed the components specified in the Ordnance Manual or not. Oil based paint is getting harder and harder to find. Plus modern "olives" are a different shade of green than the CW version.

    Paint stores might be able to mix up an approximastion. Some lads use this "formula" for them to mix: B 232, C 2Y40, F 18, W 1Y36 but I have never tried it.

    Federal arsenals are a longer discussion. Plus under the Federal system, arsenals and depots often shipped here and there, so it wa snot always true tat the closest state troops to a particular arsenal always got ammunition from that arsenal.

    A small Federal arsenal was ordered to be built in Columbus, Ohio in 1862 to replace the one being run by the State of Ohio June 1861- September 1863 . It opened late in 1863 early 1864.
    Ramsey ordered it closed in February 1864 and its material transferred to Allegheny Arsenal.

    Ohio State Laboratory packing boxes were stenciled under the lid "COLUMBUS" over "MONTH and YEAR"' over "OHIO in an oval stencil.

    An aside, 80 grains was not the service load for .58 expanded ball amunition.

    Curt
    In gleichem Schritt und Tritt, Curt Schmidt

    Not a real Civil War reenactor, I only portray one on boards and fora.
    I do not portray a Civil War soldier, I merely interpret one.

  6. #26
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Huntsville
    Posts
    607

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    There is an inexpensive booklet entitled something like, "Making authentic cartridges" by Patrick Reardon. In the back it has an article and plans for a Columbus Depot .69 cartridge box. I believe it was made from 3/4" thick wood.

    Steve
    Steve Sheldon

  7. #27
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Montgomery, Alabama
    Posts
    477

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    I would suggest checking with Pittsburg Paints. They used to carry a paint called "Dock Piling" which is a darker olive color and IMHO compatible with what was used in CW. My local store can still mix that tint. Oil-based or latex?
    Oil-based is longer drying but seems to stay on better.
    A.Redd
    Andy Redd

  8. #28

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    Hallo!

    My understanding is that Pittsburgh Paints discontinued "Dock Piling" several years ago, but that some paint stores may still have the color chip card or the color mixing formula archived to reproduce it.

    But since stuff on the WWW is not always current, snipped articles and referenced articles dating back from the days when it was is fairly common on-line and in unit "how to" guides.

    Curt
    In gleichem Schritt und Tritt, Curt Schmidt

    Not a real Civil War reenactor, I only portray one on boards and fora.
    I do not portray a Civil War soldier, I merely interpret one.

  9. #29
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    King of Prussia, PA
    Posts
    1,588

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    Quote Originally Posted by Curt-Heinrich Schmidt View Post
    Hallo!

    My understanding is that Pittsburgh Paints discontinued "Dock Piling" several years ago, but that some paint stores may still have the color chip card or the color mixing formula archived to reproduce it.

    Curt
    My local Benjamin Moore paint dealer was able to make up a batch of "Dock Piling" for me, with nothing more than dried paint on a stick. It was so close that I repainted one Ammo Box right up to the stencils and you couldn't tell where the old and new paint left off!

    Never say always, or never. The .69 caliber round ball box I viewed, measured, and copied; was painted olive, rather then blue, as the regulations required. Based on the stencil it was packed in 1861. The top was missing, so I have no idea which arsenal produced this ammunition. Sort of interesting. On one end only, the box was overstenciled in black paint "1000 rounds .58 blanks." It's my guess that the original .69 ammo was never issued and replaced with the blanks after the War was over.

    BTW, round ball ammunition was supposed to be in blue boxes, while buck shot went into red boxes. Does anyone know what color was used for buck & ball ammunition? It's my understanding the buck & ball was about the most common .69 ammunition used during the War, but the 1863 Ordnance Manual doesn't list it.
    Bill Rodman, If you need a really bad example.
    King of Prussia, PA
    wrodman1@aol.com

  10. #30
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    28

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    I talking about the wood box they put the packs of cartridges in to distribute to the troops like what color would that be painted?

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