How to make paper cartridges for revolvers?

[maillemaker]

I think he is asking about live rounds again, the video isn't too bad for commercial rounds, the CS Ordnance manual gives the paper sizes for .44 and .36 which are just tiny little paper rounds like long arm ammo. You can see why commercial ammo was so popular. I have used cigarette papers, they have some nitrite in them and had no problem with spark making it through, they are fragile but the "store bought" rounds had boxes that were designed to protect fragile little rounds.

Yes, thanks I'm asking about live rounds. I have the CS Ordnance manual I will look up their details on revolver ammunition. I am mostly curious at this point how the lead bullet was secured to the cartridge mouth. Was it glued in place?

This guy is using someone's fantastic replicas - even the boxes are right with some of them having a copper wire to rip out to open them. But he won't say who makes them.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4vx_nQphKO4

Steve

[Curt-Heinrich Schmidt]

Hallo!

Gum arabic.

In brief and to over generalize...

There were three types of pistol cartridges "around," as the Ordnance folks seemed unable to decide on just onei the 1840's and 1850's. Contract ones ("Colt" style) tended to be like the one in the video. However, some of the Federal arsenals also made pistol cartridges that were similar to the "tube" or "cylinder" types but had a folding tail as did the Minie cartridges.
The "odd" group were the ones that did not have an exposed conical ball on the end but rather were just like little "Minie" cartridges complete with tie string (which is what the 1861 Ordnance Manual called for).
And, they also made pistol cartridges enclosing a round ball instead of a conical.

Curt



Curt

[maillemaker]

There were three types of pistol cartridges "around," as the Ordnance folks seemed unable to decide on just onei the 1840's and 1850's. Contract ones ("Colt" style) tended to be like the one in the video. However, some of the Federal arsenals also made pistol cartridges that were similar to the "tube" or "cylinder" types but had a folding tail as did the Minie cartridges.
The "odd" group were the ones that did not have an exposed conical ball on the end but rather were just like little "Minie" cartridges complete with tie string (which is what the 1861 Ordnance Manual called for).
And, they also made pistol cartridges enclosing a round ball instead of a conical.

Wow, this is cool info.

so I assume that the ones like little Minnie cartridges were designed to be used like Minnie cartridges - tear off the tail, dump in the powder, remove and seat the naked ball?

Steve

[Curt-Heinrich Schmidt]

Hallo!

Correct. But, 1860 experiments ended up listening to complaints that "The strong paper with which our cartridges are made has to be torn off to allow the powder to be poured in the chamber, a difficult thing to do even by a dismounted man under favorable circumstances.. -without losing a portion of the charge, a part at times entering an adjoining chamber, at hazard of several cartridges being fired off at one time. Accidents of this kind have frequently occurred." (June 22, 1860. John Symington)


Curt

[Boyd Miles]

That is pretty much how they worked for me when I tried it, tiny musket cartridges are hard to handle.

[Poor Private]

If your interested in live firing of your handguns or longguns. Go to www muzzleloadignforum.com . they have several threads on making pistol cartridges.

[Poor Private]

While trolling on the computer this morning I came across this . Dixie now has ammo packs available for those who are not handy. it is a 6 pack of .44 caliber pistol cartridges. wrapped in period paper and labels. The cost is $19.95 for a package. They say it is .454 Hornaday round ball, and 22grainsw of fffg Goex powder. For those who are handy it might not be a bad idea of picking up one and dissecting the pack for making dups. of labels, cartridges, and wrapping.

[Ross L. Lamoreaux]

While trolling on the computer this morning I came across this . Dixie now has ammo packs available for those who are not handy. it is a 6 pack of .44 caliber pistol cartridges. wrapped in period paper and labels. The cost is $19.95 for a package. They say it is .454 Hornaday round ball, and 22grainsw of fffg Goex powder. For those who are handy it might not be a bad idea of picking up one and dissecting the pack for making dups. of labels, cartridges, and wrapping.

Not to downplay what initially sounds like a good idea, I caution people in using a reproduction as the guide to replicating something of the period, particularly a reproduction that has flaws in construction, material, and labeling. When you make a copy of a unauthentic copy, you get an unauthentic copy. I understand that it is much easier to obtain reproductions than to view originals, but the originals are out there if researching hard enough. I've seen the Dixie repros firsthand and they are lacking if you are looking for a true reproduction. They are adequate if looking for something a cut-above from the norm, but not good enough for the discerning progressive.

[TheQM]

Hallo!

Correct. But, 1860 experiments ended up listening to complaints that "The strong paper with which our cartridges are made has to be torn off to allow the powder to be poured in the chamber, a difficult thing to do even by a dismounted man under favorable circumstances.. -without losing a portion of the charge, a part at times entering an adjoining chamber, at hazard of several cartridges being fired off at one time. Accidents of this kind have frequently occurred." (June 22, 1860. John Symington)

Curt

A chain fire when shooting live rounds could mess up your entire day. Not to mention doing a job on your weapon. We now have 150 years experience in shooting cap & ball revolvers. That's an advantage the old boys didn't have. There's now a lot of information available on safely shooting these weapons. I would take heed, even if it's not period correct.

[the other nathan]

Hallo!

Gum arabic.

In brief and to over generalize...

There were three types of pistol cartridges "around," as the Ordnance folks seemed unable to decide on just onei the 1840's and 1850's. Contract ones ("Colt" style) tended to be like the one in the video. However, some of the Federal arsenals also made pistol cartridges that were similar to the "tube" or "cylinder" types but had a folding tail as did the Minie cartridges.
The "odd" group were the ones that did not have an exposed conical ball on the end but rather were just like little "Minie" cartridges complete with tie string (which is what the 1861 Ordnance Manual called for).
And, they also made pistol cartridges enclosing a round ball instead of a conical.

Curt



Curt

Sorry to resurrect an old thread, but I came across a couple of item that might add to the conversation.

This link shows a variety of period and late period rifle and pistol ammo. It shows much of the variety that Curt alludes to in his post.

A good article here shows a few of the different ammo shape/style boxes depending on manufacture.

Cheers,
Nathan

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1st MN Vol Inf.