BGA 150th Shiloh

[Ala-Sippi Rifle]

We were on the receiving end of that barrage. It was INCREDIBLE!!! I thought our whole line was going to break in run all the way back to Corinth. We were greatly outnumbered and had no chance. Many of us skeedaddled once we got back in the trees and lived to fight another day.

[Spinster]

Logistics in King's camp were bad. There were not enough port-a-johns for the numbers, let alone not getting cleaned, ostensibly because of mud. Not having tp is an annoyance, which is why I had raided old MRE packets prior to coming. But not having water is inexcusable. It is life-threatening. The water buffaloes were not large enough, or there were not enough of them, for the numbers in King's camp. And if the dang artillery can haul their pieces back and forth and take their crews to ride to the battle grounds (really, folks can't walk?), then vehicles can get in to refill the water.

If someone had died or gotten seriously injured for lack of water........

I'll beg to differ here Miss Grimshaw. The problem has to do with the weight of water. At over eight pounds to the gallon, the weight of large tanks coupled with lack of baffles in the tanks makes driving them a larger job than it seems.

The same is true for sanitation trucks--they are carrying both cleaning water in and liquid waste out, with even more pounds per gallon. We pretty well wrecked the pumper truck trying to pull it with tractors when it could not make it on its own.

Despite the inability of the pump trucks, toilet paper was resupplied, including to King's area. I helped do that in some camps, and plainly saw the supply vehicle turn down King's road. How long that resupply lasted I don't know.

It would have been a kindness if the artillery tow vehicles had refrained from making a second trip to haul their men, and lessen the pressure on the roads. Just as it would have been a kindness if certain Confederate troops had refrained from draining a Federal water tank to refill canteens, when their own water wagons were with them, full of water, and the refill tanks for those water wagons readily accessible on the field.





It would have been a kindness

[gambit88]

Those other artillery trucks are partly why we pulled out Saturday afternoon. The tow vehicles were getting stuck and one gun was nearly lost. It wasnt worth damaging our gun. Watching yhem trucks by artillery camp proved good entertainment though. We started making bets on who wouldy get stuck and who wouldn't.

[Ala-Sippi Rifle]

Bill, Yall did have the best seats in the house as far as entertainment goes. I was unfortunate to get stuck there with my gear trailer in "Artillery Corner" but did meet a couple of Confederates from Ohio that gave me a much appreciated pull all the way out to the road Friday evening. I had no intention of bringing my gear trailer originally but we had a bunch of fresh fish in our ranks so I had to bring all the extra gear I have.

[flattop32355]

I will give kudo's where due: When the Federal water supply problems became known, Terry Crowder, overall Federal commander, ordered up additional supplies, which arrived within a very reasonable time. We were not without water for very long.

My one grand suggestion on this problem would be spending a relatively small sum to purchase tapering nozzles for the spigots. Much water that could have gone into canteens was lost due to spillage, and this alone may have prevented a significant amount of the shortage we experienced.

As Quartermaster/liaison for the Army of the Ohio, I was made acutely aware of the logistical problems encountered, and these were reported up the chain of command. None of these concerns were ignored, and command was as frustrated as anyone else. All that could be done was done; some things just didn't work out. Lessons were learned.

[Spinster]

Excellent suggestion Bernie. Reducers do cause their own problems though, slowing flow from the tanks for those watering animals or obtaining water for cooking. Sites which are not piped cannot help but encounter supply problems.

And having participated in the two work days it took to pipe the Corinth site several years ago, I'll never recommend that for a site again. I was not at the work days it took to pull all that pipe out after the event (part of the lease requirement, along with reconnecting fences)

Water 'leakage' is always a problem because we as modern American people do not treat it as a limited resource--even when we see it trucked in and should have a clue as to what it takes.

In the course of the event, those dealing with water supply witnessed:

(1). Men deliberately kicking the faucet off a tank to get at the small amount of remaining water, rendering the tank useless for the rest of the event. There were tanks with water within 75 yards

(2) Men dumping full or nearly full canteens on the ground when water wagons arrived. I'd understand pouring it over their heads, but this is outright waste.

(3) Tank taps opened and left running while participants simply walked away.

(4) Everything from hair washing to dish washing under the open tank valves, using far more water than was needed for the task.


Here's one example of conservative water use: Wagon Camp fed anywhere from 40 to 70 people at any given meal, and up to 200 for some meals. Dish wash was set up at two meals, while the noon meal tends to be 'hand food'. Three inches of boiling water was poured into two tin dishpans. Flatware washed first, well scraped plates went in second, and greasy pans third, and subsequently rinsed.

The greasy dishwater was discarded. The relatively clean dish rinse water, still warm, was used as wash water each morning for the previous days' undergarments or shirts (we were on site for 9 days). A new pan with 3 inches of hot water was used to rinse the well wrung clothes, which were then wrung out again. Finally, that last pan of warm rinse water was either left for hand washing, or absorbed by towels dipped in for use in personal washing.

All that from about four gallons of water.

Was it all necessary? No, most flatwear can be licked clean, most plates cleaned with grass, leaves, or sand. We'd rather not though. Still, sanitation for 40, for less water used than someone rinsing their dishes under an open tank valve.

In watering off wagons, I see an awful lot of impatience on the part of those filling. Certainly it's awkward to fill from plastic containers. The mortality rate is high, and I'm amazed when containers come back with valves broken off and missing. We have reducers on some containers, but that varies with the wagoner, as we each supply our own containers for the wagons.

We wish there was a better way. Some wagons employ large water bladders, but these fixed installations limit the use of the wagon for other purposes, and can damage the wagon floor.


All of this beats ditches and farm ponds as water supply.

[44 Henry]

I know that event planners do try to have enough of everything for the event but sometimes unforseen problems do happen. Being an old Eagle Scout(196 I learned a long time ago to plan for the unexpected or in other words Be Prepared. TP and water are 2 items I will always bring just in case the unexpected happens. 5 gallons of water and a couple of rolls of TP goes a long way in getting a person through those unexpected situations. I usually hide a bottle of water in the haversack for the battlefield to resupply the canteen. And then there are those reenactors that do not start planning for the event until a week before or even the day before and do not even get their blanks made up. The bottom line is, like my mom used to say, God helps those who help themselves. Shiloh was a very good event and I look forward to more of the 150th events. Good Job to those that planned Shiloh.
WSS 66th Illinois Infantry

[RJSamp]

Excellent suggestion Bernie. Reducers do cause their own problems though, slowing flow from the tanks for those watering animals or obtaining water for cooking. Sites which are not piped cannot help but encounter supply problems.

And having participated in the two work days it took to pipe the Corinth site several years ago, I'll never recommend that for a site again. I was not at the work days it took to pull all that pipe out after the event (part of the lease requirement, along with reconnecting fences)

All of this beats ditches and farm ponds as water supply.

Reducer's can be on a couple of spigots for canteen refill....thus not interfering with bucket and pot filling at all Terre, and significantly reducing wastage.

Those 5 gallon blue plastic buckets set up a 'hoarding' situation, similar to stacks of firewood by a company street or community cooking' fire.
I've always brought my own TP and water reserve to national events....and 2 canteens on the battlefield. That's ALWAYS. 6,000 reenactors that's potentially 30,000 gallons of water (240,000 pounds) that doesn't have to be distributed/toted/hauled by Mark Way or wagon.

We need a Mandatory unlimited water supply on site within a half mile of each camp for both man and beast (and appropriate watering troughs).....this could be the fill site for wagons and tractor hauled water\water buffaloes.....the water supply needs to be available 24/7 regardless of weather and electrical grid status (backup generator for the well pump). We can't be going into town for this (learned at Raymond 2001). And we can't jeopardize the well being of 500 head of stock. The ponds were largely inaccessible at Shiloh.

I hear you on the PIPING of water....but this was a life saver at Manassas (with its twin 4" PVC pipes running under pressure and Pallets of plastic water bottles on the battlefield), A135 (which set the standard with rigid pipe, not PVC), G135 with its semi-trailer stainless steel milk truck IN the cavalry camp, and Raymond 2001 (which had piped water in the CSA camps). Where we get into trouble (A140 with flexible hose and no water pressure, Raymond 2001 with trucked water and Dr. Pepper containers in the Federal Camps, Wilson's Creek with its breakdown in logistics, and now Shiloh) is where we rely on trucked\wagoned water to fill supply tanks, 5 gallon in tent reservoirs, 10,000 canteens, 250+ gallon reservoirs, ditches (from wastage), laundry and dish tubs, coffee pots, Bathing water....the distribution tanks themselves.....and then forget the time delay in restocking all of these vessels complicated by distribution issues (impassable roads and traffic jams). Having worked through many a demand scenario in business logistics (successfully), I know we need to, and can, get better in this. 5 gallons per reenactor per day + 20 gallons per horse per day + 1 fill of all the tubs\canteens\5 gallon in-tent buckets\tanks\wagon and truck borne containers\watering troughs\on battlefield supply = a lot of gallons....and I guarantee is a lot more than was planned for at Shiloh. You can't fill to the tubs capacity, you have to fill to Demand....which usually means more tubs.

Simply having a canteen and 5 gallon plastic bucket fill location on the way to the camps (Registration?) would have gone a LONG way to relieve the immediate shortage situation which cropped up almost immediately.

We also have to teach horse\mule\draft animal owners that in the American Civil War watering call frequently meant taking your equine friends a half MILE or more to a watering source (I've got some great quotes of bareback racing to\from watering source 2+ miles away).... maybe you can lead horses from the artillery camp 200 yards to the cavalry camp and water your horses there, rather than walking a half mile to headquarters at midnight to bitch about water shortages?

Every time I saw artillery trucks moving around the battlefield, I wondered how much water they were hauling.....

I'm with Andrew on this one.....bring your own TP and 5 gallons of water (you simply dig a small hole, use leaves or a rubber blanket to hide the jug) PER PERSON.

[Spinster]

RJ brings up another excellent observation.

Though there are individuals with long experience, this hobby has a short collective memory. With the rise of the 'regional' event in recent years, and the economy strangling larger scale events, we've forgotten how to go to a National.

Used to be, the rules of thumb were pretty well known

1. Go without a tent if you can
2. If you have a tent, put little more than your bedroll and yourself in it. Don't bring everything you own.
3. Bring a five gallon water container-now, I always bring mine full from home, but that's just me.
4. Bring toilet paper. What do y'all think those functional pockets in the tails of frock coats are FOR, anyway?
5. Be prepared to walk. You wanna 'educate the public', you're not doing that on a gator or a trailer.
6. Pack your food up at home and bring it in the first time. Those multiple runs to the Walmart only clog up the road. Get in, get set up, get dressed, stayed dressed, and live in the moment.

I don't know how to solve the 'piping problem' RJ. We've done it before and there's always been a vulnerable point somewhere that got broken fairly early on--either by truck weight at a crossing, or by some body (like me taking out the civilian water line at Raymond II when my nice orderly firepit became an artersian well with my last shovel full). Then there were the folks at the end of the Manassas pipelines--that didn't work out so well either.

Getting folks to water Livestock at any distance seems to be problematic for many. I'm not knowledgeable enough on that account to provide a solution as all I ever take to water is the oxen, who really take themselves. I do know that horses and mules need to be separated in picket, pastureage, and water, and that some horses won't touch a farm pond.

The event added additional tanks in the course of the weekend. I think none of us anticipated the temperatures-I'd been preaching 'wool petticoats required'' for months, and we've got another heavy frost predicted this week.

Wood, water, toilets, ice, land--all scarce resources that must be trucked in. Treat em that way.

All amenities and infrastructure comes at a cost. Some is volunteered- Men hauled heavy equipment from all over the south to place roads and water tanks at multiple work weekends. Adding more costs, and at $20 an event, I think the bulk of the hobby has reached their monetary limit in registration fee.

Registering months ahead of time helps. It's hard to absorb 1500 in last minute registrations even when we've planned well for folks who may or may not materialize. Yeah, you may loose a few bucks every once in awhile-I'm registered now for 3 fall events, with the liklihood I'll miss one. Oh well.

[pvtmonroe]

One other thing I was surprised about was all the riderless horses. We saw four or five all weekend I think. I hope nobody lost their horse but I'll be damned if I'm gonna try to grab one of those things, heh.