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Thread: Defarbed Loyalist Arms Lorenz

  1. #11
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Augusta, Georgia
    Posts
    485

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    If they were to go to the effort to close the current gap between "Reproduction" and "Replica" that is seen among Italian arms today, I think we would be talking less about "price" and more about "value".

    The bar was set 15 or 20 years ago with the Armi Sport M1842, and it remains the champ for "out of the box" historical accuracy. To have the same (or better) standards for a Type III P'53 Enfield or US M1861 would be outstanding. If such a product were to enter the market at $1000 -$1200, the din generated by the accolades would drown out the moans over high price.
    John Wickett
    Carpetbagger

  2. #12

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    Hallo!

    It used to said that...

    The quality is remembered long after the price is forgotten.

    Although $250 in 1980 was more to me than $250 today, i wish I would have/could have managed to buy a garage full of the early production of the Mike Yeck M1861 Springfields, 1862 Richmonds, and M1863 Springfields.



    Curt
    In gleichem Schritt und Tritt, Curt Schmidt

    Not a real Civil War reenactor, I only portray one on boards and fora.
    I do not portray a Civil War soldier, I merely interpret one.

  3. #13
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Bell Buckle, TN
    Posts
    95

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    The 1st of my defarbed "Loyalist Arms" Lorenz muskets is finished and will be to Blockade Runner this Saturday. I roughed the farbby polish on the steel up to reduce the near-mirror look. I had to "de-horn" it, meaning break the numerous sharp edges that would otherwise cut the shooter's hand during rough handling. I added an LSCH mark over the breech per an original I studied, and applied a few random "F" marks and "3" marks as the original had. Otherwise there is not much over-marking that has to be done. I had to reduce the wood in a few spots to meet the steel better and reduce the steel in a few to meet the wood. There are a few small gaps that could be filled, but I left them alone since adding epoxy would be visible and farbby. The "wood" they use is some sort of soft rapid-growing wood that cloggs the sandpaper badly. Oil alone leaves it very pale and ugly. So, I had to concoct some stains to add to darken itand mix that into the linseed oil. That did darken it to a sort of orangish brown. It is actually not that bad looking and likely close to the color the beech originally would have looked with just oil applied. All in all it came out fairly attractive and I think is close to the quality most Lorenz rifles probably looked when they came over. The rear sight is just a brazed-on block sight instead of the larger dovetailed version. That could be something I could later try reproducing, but this one is serviceable. Currently the bore is still smooth and .62" and we have no plans at present to line them or replace them due to costs. The current barrel is 1 piece so it is not simple a matte rof remvoving the breech and threading it to a replacement barrel. The machining to do it right would be very time consuming and thus make these guns run upward of $1k and nobody is going to buy an Indian-made Lorenze, good barrel of not for over $1000. I did proof the barrel with a double (120grs) charge of 3F and a ball and it held just fine. I have shot 1 of these with .62" balls for accuracy and it was actually just about dead-on with the sights supplied so the Indians evidently are taking the time to correctly place and notch the sights. I have no idea what BRi will charge for them. Pics and descriptions will be posted at the BRi site next week I would assume.

  4. #14
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Huntsville
    Posts
    592

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    The prototype "Enfields" submitted to the N-SSA's SAC for approval have problems with dimensions being outside of the "tolerences/specs."
    I would like to know more about this. I have been eagerly awaiting news on the new Pedersoli Enfields.

    Thanks,

    Steve
    Steve Sheldon

  5. #15
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    1,679

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    Have not heard. Only know that Pedersoli had until May 5 to submit the "corrected version" to the N-SSA Small Arms Committee.
    Craig L Barry

    Author: The Civil War Musket: A Handbook for Historical Accuracy

  6. #16
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Denmark
    Posts
    32

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    I'm surprised that there have been so many failures with the Indian made Lorenz copies, as these are also sold in the UK and Europe where they have to undergo proof testing before sale.

  7. #17
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    1,679

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    Most of the failures seem to be related to live firing with improperly seated minie balls or round balls.
    Or else some sort of blockage in the barrel. If you look closely at the posted blown barrel images, you can usually
    find the 'swell' where the blockage was located. If they are making one piece barrels it would eliminate
    the splitting risk from drilling the flash channel through the seam, which was the second most common reason.

    For my part, I would just as soon not tempt fate. I guess if you want a Lorenz and you have your heart set on
    it...an improved version of a bona-fide piece of Third World manufacturing is now at least an option. Are reasonably
    priced originals getting hard to find? They do come up from time to time.
    Craig L Barry

    Author: The Civil War Musket: A Handbook for Historical Accuracy

  8. #18
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Bell Buckle, TN
    Posts
    95

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    For those interested in the de-farb Loyalist Lorenz, Blockade Runner has my 1st one on the rack with bayoinet for $745. They have not bothered for whatever reason to advertize it on their website. I am not sure if it is just that they have been too busy with other things to work on the website or maybe they are still uncommitted to carrying these regularly. I will be doing the second one in a week or so.

  9. #19
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    1,679

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    How does it compare to the original Austrian Rifle in your collection?
    Craig L Barry

    Author: The Civil War Musket: A Handbook for Historical Accuracy

  10. #20
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Bell Buckle, TN
    Posts
    95

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    Mine of course is the odd one that has evenly spaced bands, but otherwise it appears fairly close. The wood they use is some sort of soft fruit-wood or maybe even a palm wood. The growth rings are huge so itgrows incredibly fast whatever it is. It has a lighter tone even after I added dark walnutstain to the linseed to darken it. I think the color is probably close to what linseed on beech originally looked like to them, a sort of golden tone. It is as lose as you can make the Loyalist come to looking right.

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