Confederate Sack Coat info

[GreencoatCross]

Nick,

I knew I saw that style of pocket before and it was indeed in this picture. That's the one.

[tompritchett]

What does machine buttonholes have to do with this thread? It should be moved to another thread.

I actually went back and reviewed how the topic of machine buttonholes arose in this thread to see if if the topic could be broken out. It appears that it came from the mention of an historical sack coat that was essential all machine sewn except for the button holes. In response to that another poster mentioned five Federal trousers that had machine sewn button holes. Since the evolution involved the discussion of historical articles of clothing, I consider that an acceptable evolution of thread focus. Therefore, this thread is no open to discussions of historical articles of clothing in general as long as it flows with the thread (if it does not, please start a new thread). However, I do not wish the subject of vendors reproductions of those article to become a focal point again. Thank you for your cooperation in this matter.

[W PA bumpkin]

My question is, how can a hooded overcoat be "cool" when only one exists , and on the other hand five known issue pair of trousers exist and it is questioned.

NJS

With all due respect:

are one-of-a-kind garments exempt from study even though they are documented? Does this rule only apply to officers' uniforms that were custom made? I understand your disdain for the term "mystery" jacket, but, are these also exempt from study? Look at the odd, partially completed/mismanufactured items that are 100% authentic to this period in addition to field repairs/modifications/commanding officers' specificatons.

Some of us know that sewing machine-produced garments exsisted and were offered by dry-goods' mail-order catalogues during this period even though it was a cottage industry. Take into account the number of garments that were machine sewn but finished by hand to SAVE TIME in order to fill orders. Take into account the number of civilian garments used out of neccesity by soldiers, including the popular sack coat and overcoats. Look at the VARIETY among Federal uniforms made by sub-contractors. I consider all of these when "studying" uniforms and equipment and STILL maintain an open mind with an ounce of skepticism.

Please do not count us out as jaded "career farbs" who are stuck in a particular mindset. Some of us are still learning and we remain open-minded to new information as long as it is presented to us in such a way that we are not force-fed one's personal opinion and then made to feel inferior by one's superior knowledge (and name-calling).

Still anticipating photos of the other sack coat as promised from the original topic so as to be better informed,

[Memphis]

Some of us know that sewing machine-produced garments exsisted and were offered by dry-goods' mail-order catalogues during this period even though it was a cottage industry.

Machine sewn garments as a cottage industry?

Perhaps you meant to say large scale mass production in that age of garment industry mechanization. We have a difficult time grasping the scale of manufacturing that existed in the industrialized north before and during the war.

Just my two cents,

[hanktrent]

Some of us know that sewing machine-produced garments exsisted and were offered by dry-goods' mail-order catalogues during this period even though it was a cottage industry.

I'm curious for more information on that. I've seen ads for shirts that you could purchase from the manufacturer by mail, like Ballou's French Yoke Shirts. But they seemed to be direct from the manufacturer, one product line only, rather than in with "dry-goods mail-order catalogues."

I've seen examples of wholesale catalogues, like Russell & Irwin Hardware, that sold sad irons by the dozen or horseshoes by the barrel for resale or use in a business, but can you give more information on retail catalogues selling a variety of dry-goods items including clothing, by mail direct to the consumer?

Hank Trent
hanktrent@voyager.net

[W PA bumpkin]

Machine sewn garments as a cottage industry?

Perhaps you meant to say large scale mass production in that age of garment industry mechanization. We have a difficult time grasping the scale of manufacturing that existed in the industrialized north before and during the war.

Just my two cents,

You're absolutely correct in our (my) grasp of the scale of manufacturing in the industrialized North. I do try to keep in mind that not everybody was sitting around with needle & thread in hand doing all of this sewing, but on the same note I have a difficult time imagining the mechanization of the garment industry during the mid-nineteenth century. Maybe I need to visit a few more museums and read up on this subject.

Regards,

[W PA bumpkin]

I'm curious for more information on that. I've seen ads for shirts that you could purchase from the manufacturer by mail, like Ballou's French Yoke Shirts. But they seemed to be direct from the manufacturer, one product line only, rather than in with "dry-goods mail-order catalogues."

I've seen examples of wholesale catalogues, like Russell & Irwin Hardware, that sold sad irons by the dozen or horseshoes by the barrel for resale or use in a business, but can you give more information on retail catalogues selling a variety of dry-goods items including clothing, by mail direct to the consumer?

Hank Trent
hanktrent@voyager.net

I, too, am curious even more so now. To be quite honest this has come up in conversation over the past two years between myself and a couple of pards who have been handling original uniforms and civilian garments for over thirty years. These guys have been around Civil War paraphenalia since the early 1970s and it is they who have been my personal source of knowledge in addition to the many people who I've met along the way.

I will endeavor to answer this question regarding mail-order garments to the best of my ability, and in the event that I cannot, I will admit so.

Sincerely,

[Marc Shaffer]

http://www.rootsweb.com/~orphanhm/uniforms.htm

Concerning the Weller overcoat:

"Maj. James Hewitt of the 2nd Kentucky used his personal funds to purchase special overcoats for his regiment during the winter of 1861-62. One of these unique hooded coats survives today in the Kentucky Military History Museum"

All found on the 1st Ky Orphan Brigade website. While I'm far from an expert, I believe that all sorts of clothing would have been seen on CS troops early in the war. Especially if they recieved their clothing during the time of the Great Appeal.

Regards,
Marc Shaffer

[W PA bumpkin]

Machine sewn garments as a cottage industry?

Perhaps you meant to say large scale mass production in that age of garment industry mechanization.

Just my two cents,

After re-reading my comments, what I meant was that the mail-order part was something new, due in part to the population growth in Northern cities, the Homestead Act, et al, and the need for ready-made garments. That is why I used the term "cottage industry." Industrialization was not "new" per say; rather, ordering clothing through the Postal system was.

I hope that this clarifies my point.

Also, thanks to Marc Shaffer for illuminating the provenance of the hooded Weller overcoat.
Sincerely,

[hanktrent]

I will endeavor to answer this question regarding mail-order garments to the best of my ability, and in the event that I cannot, I will admit so.

The reason I'm curious is that it's my understanding the big retail "mail order catalog" era was post-war, and that there really weren't Sears Roebuck-style catalogs pre-1865. When things were sold retail by mail, it was more individual product lines by an individual manufacturer--books or patent medicine or shirts, etc., each separately.

So I'm curious about information on general dry-goods catalogs selling retail by mail in the pre-1865 era, since it's something I'm not familiar with.

Hank Trent
hanktrent@voyager.net