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Thread: Alabama Councilman removes Confederate Flags from Confederate graves.

  1. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by gwagner
    S13A-7-23.1

    (a) Any person who willfully or maliciously injures, defaces, removes or destroys any tomb, monument, gravestone or other memorial of the dead, or any fence or any inclosure about any tomb, monument, gravestone or memorial, or who willfully and wrongfully destroys, removes, cuts, breaks or injures any tree, shrub, plant, flower, decoration, or other real or personal property within any cemetery or graveyard shall be guilty of a class A misdemeanor.


    E-mail the mayor and let him know how you feel, and the council.

    Mayor bham@auburnalabama.org
    City Council coagbemail@auburnalabama.org

    Thank you very much for that information.

  2. #12
    Join Date
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    Default

    Looks like there IS a case.
    Respects, Scott B. Lesch

    My History and Toy Soldier "blog"

    http://ilikethethingsilike.blogspot.com/


    Helping my employers achieve the American Dream since 1978.

    If there's one thing I can't stand seeing, it's Americans fighting Americans.
    ~Dan Aykroyd as Sergeant Frank Tree in 1941

  3. #13

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    SCV Telegraph
    News for SCV members

    SCV HQ SCV Blog CV Blog


    Compatriots,
    By now I think most of you have heard about the truly evil action of an official in Auburn.
    Below is a release and request for action from Alabama Division Commander Reames.
    Please read carefully and proceed as I know you can!
    Deo Vindice
    Chuck McMichael
    CiC-SCV
    scvcic72@gmail.com
    xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
    Gentlemen,

    Please find below a press Release from the Alabama Division Sons of Confederate Veterans that will go out in the mail today to The local District Attorney, Alabama Attorney General, and U.S. Chief Judge for the Middle District of Alabama.

    I have consulted with Alabama Division Judge Advocate Philip Davis on the matter and he
    informs me that for us to get the District Attorney and Attorney General to act, they will need political pressure to do so.

    To accomplish this I am calling for an intense letter writing campaign to the Four
    offices below. Please keep your letters civil, but firm.

    There is a very real likelihood that further calls for other action will be soon forthcoming.
    The Alabama Division SCV will do everything in our power to bring this miscreant to justice.

    Please forward this information to your camps.
    Alabama Division Adjutant Mike Ricketts: Please forward this to your email list.

    I thank you all for your time and effort on this very important issue.

    Sincerely,
    Robert Reames
    Alabama Division Commander
    Sons of Confederate Veterans
    rcreames@aol.com
    xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
    Alabama Governor Bob Riley
    State Capitol
    600 Dexter Avenue
    Montgomery, Alabama 36130

    District Attorney's Office
    37th Judicial Circuit of Alabama
    Nick Abbett
    2311 Gateway Drive, Suite 111
    Opelika, Alabama 36801-6889
    334-737-3446

    State of Alabama Attorney General Troy King
    500 Dexter Avenue
    Montgomery, AL 36130

    United States District Court Middle District of Alabama
    Chief Judge Mark E. Fuller
    c/o Ms. Debra P. Hackett
    Clerk of Court
    U.S. District Court
    P.O. Box 711
    Montgomery, AL 36101-0711
    xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx


    Text from press release (original signed on Division Letterhead)
    Press Release - April 28, 2009
    The Alabama Division, Sons of Confederate Veterans, repudiates the
    lawless behavior of Auburn City Councilman Arthur L. Dowdell in removing Confederate
    Memorial Flags from veteran's graves at Pine Hill Cemetery in Auburn, AL. Confederate
    veteran graves are to be lawfully respected as any other American veteran graves, according
    to United States Congressional Law.

    Councilman Dowdell stated the flags were offensive to him. He then
    broke Alabama state law when he trespassed on private property, and
    desecrated sacred burial sites, and that is offensive to us.

    By stealing and destroying the flag that was placed on a veteran's
    grave, in the very presence of his descendant, Councilman Dowdell
    violates every tenet of decent human behavior. He showed a dangerous propensity for
    taking the law into his own hands, an action that will not be tolerated or otherwise
    encouraged in others.

    We believe this crime was motivated by hate, and want to see justice
    done. We are requesting that the local District Attorney prosecute
    Councilman Dowdell to the fullest extent of the law, and if need be,
    we are counting on the Alabama Attorney General to see that the laws
    of Alabama are upheld. Further, we would like to see Federal
    Prosecuting Attorneys convict Dowdell for violating United States hate
    crime laws.
    Robert C. Reames
    Alabama Division Commander
    Sons of Confederate Veterans
    rcreames@aol.com


    xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

    Reference Material
    Opelika-Auburn News


    HTTP://www.oanow.com/oan/news/local/..._graves/69708/
    Katie Stallcup
    Staff writer
    Published: April 23, 2009

    Mary Norman was shocked Thursday afternoon when Auburn Councilman
    Arthur L. Dowdell pulled up a Confederate flag placed on her great-grandfathers's
    grave and snapped it in half, she said.
    Dowdell, who denies snapping the flag, said Thursday he was picking up his daughter from
    Auburn Junior High School near the cemetery when several people told him they had a
    problem with the flags.
    He drove to the cemetery and started pulling up flags, he said.
    "It's offensive to me,"he said. "To me, it represents the Ku Klux Klan and
    racism."
    The United Daughters of the Confederacy placed the flags earlier this week, as they have
    done for 50 years, in preparation for a celebration Sunday of Confederate Memorial Day, Norman
    said.
    Confederate Memorial Day will be celebrated as a state holiday in Alabama Monday.
    "I really didn't know exactly how to respond to him," she said. "I happen to be
    a member of the Daughters of the Confederacy. "I was very surprised, especially (as he is) a city
    councilman. I was amazed."
    Norman was not personally involved in placing the flags.
    "I'm a historian," she said. "We're not about hate, we're not about
    anything like that. We just want to honor our state's rights, and I've got Confederate
    ancestors, and I feel we should have the ability to do that."


    Norman and a friend were takin g inventory of graves at Pine Hill Cemetery in Auburn when
    Dowdell drove up and asked who put up the flags, she said.
    "One of the flags had been placed on my great grandfather's grave, who was a
    Confederate soldier," Norman said. "He just got very upset, and he went over to my
    great grandfather's grave, picked up the flag and broke it in two."
    She said Dowdell did not know the plot she stood on was her family's. The flags were
    placed on soldiers' graves as a mark of respect, she said.
    He pulled up Confederate flags from other soldiers' graves, too, she said.
    Dowdell said in his years as councilman, he had never seen so many Confederate flags in one
    place.
    "I'm going on the record that this will never happen again," Dowdell said. "This
    will never happen again as long as I'm on the city council."
    Dowdell denied intentionally snapping the flag.
    "It might have snapped itself," he said. "If it did, so what? If I had my way, I would
    have broke them all up and stomped on them and burned them. That flag represents another
    country, another nation."
    Auburn Mayor Bill Ham said he was unaware of any incidents at the cemetery but said he
    talked with Dowdell Thursday afternoon. Ham said his understanding was that all city
    cemeteries have covenants governing how and what types of decorations can be placed on
    graves, except for Pine Hill because it is so old. Ham said he believed Dowdell asked an
    assistant city manager to look into making policies equal for cemeteries across the city.
    "The bottom line is those grave plots are deeded property," Ham said. "We sell
    those. So they are sold to the family of the individuals, and I think (plot owners) have a right to do exactly what they did, according to the city attorney."
    Ham said in his conversation with Dowdell, the councilman suggested the flags be placed on
    the graves for a shorter period of time, perhaps for 24 hours before the event.
    For now, the remaining flags will stay on the graves because of the lack of covenant governing
    Pine Hill, Ham said. But that could change in coming years.
    "I certainly think we need to be consistent in all the cemeteries with whatever the policy
    is, not only with this, but with everything," Ham said. "The council has got to make
    that decision."


    xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxxxxxx
    AlabamaCode on desecration of venerated objects.
    Section 13A-11-12
    Desecration of venerated objects.
    (a) A person commits the crime of desecration of venerated objects if he intentionally:
    (1) Desecrates any public monument or structure or place of worship or burial; or
    (2) Desecrates in a public place the United States or Alabama flag or
    any other object of veneration by the public or a substantial segment thereof.
    (b) Desecration of venera ted objects is a Class A misdemeanor.
    (Acts 1977, No. 607, p. 812, §5555.)

    U.S. Federal Law
    Public Law 85-425 passed on May 23, 1958 states: .......the term "veteran" includes a
    person who served in the military or naval forces of the Confederate States of
    America during the Civil War.....








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  4. #14
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    110

    Default

    Wow! Just goes to prove you can't fix stupid!

    Bill Feuchtenberger
    Co.H
    1st South Carolina Volunteers
    "It Do"

  5. #15
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Montgomery, Alabama
    Posts
    438

    Default Cemetery desecration

    Councilman Dowdell showed both his ignorance and arrogance. His ilk preach tolerance only to the extent that their beliefs and actions are tolerated. Other viewpoints and beliefs are not permitted and the holders of such other beliefs are generally made the subject of personal attack and vilification. In this instance, Dowdell showed open disdain for the fallen heroes whose graves he desecrated. He should be prosecuted for his actions. Were someone to desecrate the grave of, say, Martin Luther King, Jr.. no stone would remain unturned until the culprit was apprehended and punished.
    But in this case, do not look to the Mayor of Auburn to do anything. Nor is it likely that the DA or Alabama's Attorney General will take any action. It is not politically correct to do so...there is no percentage for them in them taking action. Dowdell will merely play the "race card" and nothing will happen. His constituents will view him as a hero and he will remain on the city council. And it is most probable that he will pull another such stunt in the future. Who is the racist and the hater in this episode?
    We have come to this, and more's the pity.

    A.Redd
    Last edited by reddcorp; 04-28-2009 at 03:34 PM.
    Andy Redd

  6. #16
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Gloucester, Mass
    Posts
    5,110

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    It would be great if the Councilman gets justice in court and at the ballot box for doing this. Hate to see it as a them and us matter. Hopefully responsible folks will prevail.
    Respects, Scott B. Lesch

    My History and Toy Soldier "blog"

    http://ilikethethingsilike.blogspot.com/


    Helping my employers achieve the American Dream since 1978.

    If there's one thing I can't stand seeing, it's Americans fighting Americans.
    ~Dan Aykroyd as Sergeant Frank Tree in 1941

  7. #17
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Council Bluffs, IA
    Posts
    30

    Default Grave Disrespect

    Just sent my two cents to one of the board members. Enclosed is a copy of what I sent. This might help but as quoted before, you can not fix stupid.

    Dear Sirs:

    http://www.cwreenactors.com/forum/sh...ad.php?t=13638

    The above link is to the Civil war reenactors board. It includes links to the news article published in the Auburn, Alabama paper regarding this councilman. Please read the whole posting. This board honors the memories of both Union and Confederate soldiers and is one of the vital links to American Civil War Re-enactors. We are living historians and every time we go out we are teaching history. "If we do not learn from what history teaches us, we are doomed to repeat it." Being POLITICALLY CORRECT sometimes is not always correct. Since the Good Councilman admits his deed in the published paper, how would he feel if someone desecrated his grandfathers resting place or maybe he father's as I do not know if they are alive or deceased? I do not think he would like it much. The KEY point is RESPECT for ALL both living and dead. It is time that history get back toi basics and not be glossed over because it is uncomfortable for some!

    I have just read the recent posting concerning the removal of memorial flags from the graves in question. How would you feel if someone removed the flags of fallen Federal soldiers or our veterans who have served so proudly. I sincerely think you would not stand for it. As the great grandson of a confederate soldier, I would not be pleased to no end. By the way he did survive the late war. This was an uncalled for action by the councilman.


    Your humble servant

    Lenwood R Brightwell
    Omaha, Nebraska

  8. #18
    trainwreck Guest

    Default

    very well writen RB...I reenact with the 4th Alabama (Co. B.(as well as the 15th Mass)) I may not have been doing it long but i feel a sharp blow by reading those pages affecting the men I, aswell as all of you, honor by reenacting. This shouldnt be tolerated. these were people once. Americans. and they made the ultimate sacrifice in the war. it doesnt matter what they might have, or not have stood for. I've posted an article on the flags on a Canobie Lake Park fan forum and what responce (albiet little) i got was what a terrible thing was happaning...if not in the historic sence than in the "why would someone desicrate other peoples property like that"....

    Just my two cents....let me be please

  9. #19
    Join Date
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    Location
    Gloucester, Mass
    Posts
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    Quote Originally Posted by trainwreck
    very well writen RB...I reenact with the 4th Alabama (Co. B.(as well as the 15th Mass)) I may not have been doing it long but i feel a sharp blow by reading those pages affecting the men I, aswell as all of you, honor by reenacting. This shouldnt be tolerated. these were people once. Americans. and they made the ultimate sacrifice in the war. it doesnt matter what they might have, or not have stood for. I've posted an article on the flags on a Canobie Lake Park fan forum and what responce (albiet little) i got was what a terrible thing was happaning...if not in the historic sence than in the "why would someone desicrate other peoples property like that"....

    Just my two cents....let me be please
    I hope you were polite and used spell check.
    Respects, Scott B. Lesch

    My History and Toy Soldier "blog"

    http://ilikethethingsilike.blogspot.com/


    Helping my employers achieve the American Dream since 1978.

    If there's one thing I can't stand seeing, it's Americans fighting Americans.
    ~Dan Aykroyd as Sergeant Frank Tree in 1941

  10. #20
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Easton, PA
    Posts
    5,145

    Default

    I hope you were polite and used spell check.
    While I normally do not condone people making negative comments on other people's spelling and grammar, Scott makes a very good point here. In cases such as this, when we do comment, we need to put our best foot forward and not look like a bunch of highly emotional, uneducated red-necks. Whether we like it or not, people will judge what you say as much as on the presentation as on the actual content. If you are ranting or raving or if your argument is loaded with grammatical and spelling errors, it is easier for the other side to use that presentation to easy dismiss the argument against their stance rather than give it the serious consideration that you wanted for it to have.
    Thomas H. Pritchett
    Moderator, Military & Other Business Conferences
    www.campgeiger.org

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