Can campaigner numbers ever rise?

[Regular3]

Good events with larger numbers will not be possible until two things change.
First, the uncontested assertions from those who claim "campaigners" are a bunch of dour, demanding Puritan* purists who don't have any fun.
Second, the handful of dour, demanding Puritan purists who heckle, hound, emasculate and tear down good events with larger numbers. They give credence to the myth that we're not having any fun.

To the mind of this fence-sitting mainstreamer, there are too many who display the behaviors of the dour, demanding purists ... And unfortunately they're conceiving, organizing, and running events that seem to say pointedly "we are the anti-mainstream, and proud of it." Otherwise, why hold a reenactment of a rather insiginificant backwater action (Rich Mountain) a week before a major anniversary event? They know that for a whole host of reasons from standards to fuel costs to travel time to unit commitments, etc., few if any mainstreamers are going to do large events back-to-back - And that's the way they want it.

As for fun, the dour, demanding purists are having lots of it, making fun of mainstreamers on the AC Forum.

[Wounded_Zouave]

>>1) have a stationary event, camp like the originals did for that battle<<

During battle the troops often men slept under arms in battleline... no fixed camp. But how often is this actually done at events, campaigner or 'streamer?

- Cyruss Simons

[Bill_Cross]

To the mind of this fence-sitting mainstreamer, there are too many who display the behaviors of the dour, demanding purists... who are conceiving, organizing, and running events that seem to say pointedly "we are the anti-mainstream, and proud of it." Otherwise, why hold a reenactment of a rather insiginificant backwater action (Rich Mountain) a week before a major anniversary event?

Not true! Events are often determined by when the land is available. No event organizer I've ever worked with has said "let's schedule this right next to the Battle of Big Butt so no Streamers will show up." It's usually quite the opposite. But it plays to mainstreamer prejudices for you to say otherwise.

Would we like to stay clear of big events that draw off our crossovers? Absolutely! Are there organizers who don't want crossovers? A few, but their events are the 50-100 man variety.

And your characterization of campaigners as "dour, demanding purists" is not supported by the actual events and their standards. Do we have standards? Yes. Are they hard to meet? For all but the reenactor who simply doesn't care about his impression, no. I'm good friends with Joe "Jersey Skillet" Hoffman, and he's told me for years that his best customers for his premium gear come from the mainstream.

We aren't the "anti-mainstream," we're the alternative.

I'm in marketing, and if you don't offer customers a distinction from the competition, why on earth are they going to buy your product or service? The same is true for this hobby: if you want to experience something closer to what the Civil War soldier experienced, then you have an alternative. It's why hardcore mainstreamers like Bill Rodman become members of campaigner groups. Bill LOVES mainstream events (ask him), but he also likes the alternative experience of campaigning.

Darrell, with all due respect, I've never seen you at any of the "crossover-friendly" events. Have you been to McDowell? The Recons? You might want to try one.

As for fun, the dour, demanding purists are having lots of it, making fun of mainstreamers on the AC Forum.

Gee, sticks and stones. And mainstreamers piss all over campaigners on this forum, big deal. It's time you fence sitters stopped bellyaching about evil campaigners and simply jumped in the water. The Rowdy Pards are going to be at Rich Mountain. I don't recall hearing anyone asking where they could fall in with some campaigners and feel welcome????

[dustyswb]

To the mind of this fence-sitting mainstreamer, there are too many who display the behaviors of the dour, demanding purists ... And unfortunately they're conceiving, organizing, and running events that seem to say pointedly "we are the anti-mainstream, and proud of it." Otherwise, why hold a reenactment of a rather insiginificant backwater action (Rich Mountain) a week before a major anniversary event? They know that for a whole host of reasons from standards to fuel costs to travel time to unit commitments, etc., few if any mainstreamers are going to do large events back-to-back - And that's the way they want it.

As for fun, the dour, demanding purists are having lots of it, making fun of mainstreamers on the AC Forum.

Darrell, my question to you is "What do you want to do? Something you've done all your reenacting "career" over and over again or something that is new and different? The invitation is out to everyone. If one doesn't know of the event because their "leaders" don't put it in the unit newsletter or it doesn't appear in CCG, then they are losing out, IMO.

"Unit commitments" too often equates to being a lemming. Folks who don't talk to others in the hobby or don't use the internet don't know of the "alternate" events. They are restricting themselves immensly. Free thinking is a lost art in reenacting.

As to your last statement, that's just laughable..............

[Greg Deese]

Can campaigner numbers ever rise? Answer: Yes, they already are. The numbers have increased steadily and will continue to do so, as long as we don't conflict events and support each other, especially among people that care about history anyways.

Greg Deese

[Wild Rover]

No Dusty- you said-

"Unit commitments" too often equates to being a lemming. Folks who don't talk to others in the hobby or don't use the internet don't know of the "alternate" events. They are restricting themselves immensly. Free thinking is a lost art in reenacting.

Most reenactors do not have the time, or want to spend the time searching for information, but rather elect others to do so.

Maybe 5% of the hobby is as free floating as you desire, that's it. The rest don't.

And telling them they need to is like scolding a teenager.

Working within and with organizations is the key...circumventing them only creates tension that is counterproductive.

That teamwork is what will move us all forward.

Pards,

[dustyswb]

Chris, I would agree with you to a point, but if a leader of a group doesn't use every source available to give his group choices, how good a leader is he?

No one "needs" to do anything. But if you are counting on someone to "plan" your season, you are doing yourself a disservice.

And if you are in the hobby to recreate the Civil War, you will take the time.

If you are in it to party with friends in warm clothes, the setting doesn't matter.

[Bill_Cross]

If a leader of a group doesn't use every source available to give his group choices, how good a leader is he?

You're both right up to a point.

When I was still in my mainstream unit back in 2000, I suggested to the "captain" that he let the lads know about McDowell. When he found out it was going to conflict with Hammonassett, he wouldn't even consider mentioning it, because H. was a USV-sanctioned event, and he didn't want to appear to undermine the USV (another example of why deconfliction is bullshit). I tried to point out that no one who would think of going to one event would go to the other, but there was no convincing him: it was a conflict.

No one "needs" to do anything. But if you are counting on someone to "plan" your season, you are doing yourself a disservice.

That's why there are Internet sites and huckleberries to go with them.

I agree with Chris that scolding isn't going to shame anyone into switching. But if someone's already predisposed to consider an alternative, then campaigning isn't as difficult or as scary as the rumor mill would make it seem, especially given how kit has improved. I was talking with a friend the other day about coming back to McDowell in gray this time, and he hemmed and hawed about the cost of sweating up a gray kit. We talked about what Fed gear he could use, what CS gear he could borrow, and pretty soon it was down to a jacket, a hat and a pair of britches. Some of that we might even be able to lend him.

It's an alternative experience, friends, not adult circumscision.

If you're happy with your present events, then don't continue reading this thread. If you're restless and looking for something new, email me privately, email Bill Watson, email Dusty Chapman, the list is long with different personalities to suit about all comers.

What are you waiting for? You CAN have it both ways.

[Regular3]

Not true! Events are often determined by when the land is available. No event organizer I've ever worked with has said "let's schedule this right next to the Battle of Big Butt so no Streamers will show up." It's usually quite the opposite. But it plays to mainstreamer prejudices for you to say otherwise.

You're right - It's probably more along the lines of "there's a megafest the week after that - So what?" And you're also right about prejudices. I'm trying to lose mine but they keep coming back.

Darrell, with all due respect, I've never seen you at any of the "crossover-friendly" events. Have you been to McDowell? The Recons? You might want to try one.

Right again, I have yet to make one, but it really is not for lack of desire or interest or the tunnel-visioned attitude that anything CPH related is bad. It's just that dang it, so far every time one has come up that I'm sure I can get to (starting with Berkeley Hundred), life has gotten in the way ... Or I find the "lemming-like" connection to the organization I just happen to be president of this year intrudes. But I swear that before I get too old to do this any more I am going to get to one. Maybe McDowell next year ... And since I am president, I'll see about getting it scheduled as a unit event.

Gee, sticks and stones.

Touche. I stand chastened. See above about prejudices.

[Wild Rover]

Dusty,

You're right. It is the leaders job to scout out all events, and work to be sure the events selected appeal to the whole unit.

And when one wishes to host events, approaching the unit leaders and working through the chain of command is the right and honorable approach.

Trying to snare portions of the unit in an "unofficial" manner has lead to many a bump in the road.

Most reenactors value unit loyalty over self enjoyment.

Really.