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Indyguy
06-30-2006, 05:18 AM
I was wondering how does one stiffen up the hardee hat? I have one and in the rain it became quite limp and remains somewhat that way is there a way to "style" the hat and make it stay?
And would the state volunteers been issued the hardee as a dress item even it it was not the "issue" cap for the regt.? As I said Iam new and just want to get it right. Thanks

Big Irish Will
35th IVI Aco. 1st Irish

ScottCross
06-30-2006, 11:41 AM
First of all you need to start with a quality Uniform Hat. Your standard sutler row variety is going to wilt at the first sign of rain. The originals are fur felt, not wool felt and that is why your hat collapsed. You can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear. Got to Tim bender and get yourself a good one.
http://www.benderhats.com/

Scott Cross

HighPrvt
06-30-2006, 12:27 PM
I second what Scott said, and also recomend Tim Bender. Tim's hats are superior to the other quality makers. Ya know what though, a little tweakage does add character.

For example.........

http://www.albumtown.com/data2/85a3e572a7b6fb6583d3a3106d77bcca/64963_p1048713.jpg

theknapsack
06-30-2006, 12:30 PM
Big Irish Will,

I agree with Mr. Cross. Get yourself a good one and you won't have to worry. the reason they stay stiff is shellac, a period hardening chemical. Bender's hats have correct hat ribbon, label, and sweat band, along with it being fur-felt and shellacked. He's really great to deal with too! The hat is worth every penny you pay for it.

Riley Ewen

Indyguy
06-30-2006, 05:31 PM
Well, Thanks everyone
I admit this one was a cheaper sutler row Hardee, and it's not stitched correctly.
And if I tear up a sutler row hat in a battle I won't feel too bad, and it has alot of character.But I will check in to a Bender. Thanks

Big Irish Will
1st Irish Regt. IVI

Popeye
07-01-2006, 12:51 PM
Scott and the others have you steered in the right direction. I got a medium bowler from him about 8 years or better ago and it's still my best hat. Oh yea, it's seasoned but it's still going strong. It's like everything else you buy in this hobby.....spend the money on the right stuff and you end up spending less in the end.

Popeye
NRA Life Member

VaTrooper
07-01-2006, 01:05 PM
Tim Allen make a good hat too. With Clearwater and Dirty Billy as 3rd and 4th on the list.

Regular3
07-03-2006, 09:22 PM
Tim Allen make a good hat too. With Clearwater and Dirty Billy as 3rd and 4th on the list.
I haven't seen the others, so don't take this as a recommendation for Dirty Billy, but his dress hat has advanced light years since I bought one from him for $25 at Olustee in 1986 (which I still have, by the way). My son bought one from DB about five years ago and you wouldn't know they were from the same maker.

VaTrooper
07-03-2006, 09:51 PM
Last I heard he was still cutting corners on some of the materials used. Nylon thread if I remember correctly. But this is going on things I've heard.

Rob Weaver
07-21-2006, 06:28 AM
Actually, the fur used to make hats is a little thinner now than it was in the 1860's. Some would say due to global climate change. Take it or leave it. :) However: You can re-block any hat at home with a steam iron. Set it on the wool setting and use lots of steam. When the brim is limp, iron it flat or hold it for a minute or so (until it begins to cool) in the shape you'd like. A dressmaker's ham is helpful to stuff in the crown if you'd like to re-block it. Moisture weakens, but doesn't remove, the stiffening in hats. I reblock my dress hat this way periodically (as well as my modern Stetson)

Rob Weaver
Pine River Boys
Co I 7th Wisconsin Volunteers

HighPrvt
07-21-2006, 08:13 PM
Last I heard he was still cutting corners on some of the materials used. Nylon thread if I remember correctly. But this is going on things I've heard.

I have two BD hats, and I'm pretty shure that the sweatband isn't a natural material, and I know that he uses spray glue for the lining.

bob 125th nysvi
07-23-2006, 07:13 PM
I haven't heard of a regiment being issued two different styles of hats. Maybe companies within a regiment?

So your either going to have to be with a unit that allows multiple hat types or one that wears Hardees.

I mean if your a reb you can get away with almost anything (and find an example for it) but the Blue tended to be more standardized until you became an officer. I guess rank does have its privileges.

Bob Sandusky
Co C 125th NYSVI
Esperance, NY

theknapsack
07-23-2006, 09:17 PM
Bob,

Please look at some photos of original federal soldiers. They wore all types of hats.

Thanks,

Regular3
07-24-2006, 03:38 PM
I mean if your a reb you can get away with almost anything (and find an example for it) but the Blue tended to be more standardized until you became an officer. I guess rank does have its privileges.

Bob Sandusky
Co C 125th NYSVI
Esperance, NY
It was not entirely ... Or even ... a matter of privilege for Federal officers - They were required to buy everything they wore, and so were given some latitude due to the variety of sources.

bob 125th nysvi
07-24-2006, 07:03 PM
Bob,

Please look at some photos of original federal soldiers. They wore all types of hats.

Thanks,

That Federal soldiers wore all different types of hats (geez). The question as asked (please read the question) was were soldiers ISSUED two different styles hats.

Sure soldier took what they could get depending on what the QM had and certainly when units got amalgamated different types of equipment wound up being mixed together.

But can YOU cite were a company was issued two different types of hats at the same time?

Bob Sandusky
Co C 125th NYSVI
Esperance, NY

bob 125th nysvi
07-24-2006, 07:09 PM
It was not entirely ... Or even ... a matter of privilege for Federal officers - They were required to buy everything they wore, and so were given some latitude due to the variety of sources.

of the pictures it seems the variety of sources was pretty varied.

Yeah, I know we privates get what the QM issues (or what was sent from home) and officers get to purchase from officially approved sources but some of the uniform choices had to, just had to, be out of bounds.

Witness Gen'l (Brevet) Custer's first outfit.

If that was within regs, I want to see the regs.

Bob Sandusky
Co C 125th NYSVI
Esperance, NY

theknapsack
07-24-2006, 07:10 PM
Sorry Bob,

Wasn't paying attention. Carry on. I'm gonna see if I can find that though...

Indyguy
07-24-2006, 08:35 PM
Well ,
I guess my question has been answered, Issued probably not. But I do love my hardee hat and I have a kepi I like alot. Niether of which would be issued to my unit, both would have been purchased privately or stolen:D
Here's the next question were Forage caps issued or kepis ? I have heard it both ways but seen that Forage caps were issued and kepis were bought?

Rob Weaver
07-25-2006, 05:37 AM
I understand that forage caps were issued to your unit. You should wear that, or a suitable civilian hat, rather than the dress hat or kepi. The latter is as useless a cap as ever constructed, with a brim that will not keep the sun out of your face. The former is hot, heavy, difficult to pack in the car without getting it bunged up in ways that don't look period. Thousands of dress hats were "lost" by men who hated them so much that they simply weren't willing to plop them on their heads anymore. I feel the same way about the dress hat, and wouldn't wear it myself, if I weren't a Black Hat Brigade soldier :) !

Sgt. Rob Weaver
Pine River Boys
Co I, 7th Wisconsin Volunteers

Regular3
07-25-2006, 08:58 AM
of the pictures it seems the variety of sources was pretty varied.

Yeah, I know we privates get what the QM issues (or what was sent from home) and officers get to purchase from officially approved sources but some of the uniform choices had to, just had to, be out of bounds.

Witness Gen'l (Brevet) Custer's first outfit.

If that was within regs, I want to see the regs.

Bob Sandusky
Co C 125th NYSVI
Esperance, NY
No argument here ... But then, Custer was pretty much out of bounds all the way 'round. :mrgreen:

bob 125th nysvi
07-25-2006, 08:33 PM
Sorry Bob,

Wasn't paying attention. Carry on. I'm gonna see if I can find that though...

If you find it.

I have this idea that the CW was so wide and so varied you could find a real life example for almost everything.

And I'd just love to be a whip out an authoritative source when challenged by some stich counter.

Sorry for the sarcasm last night a little too tired.

Bob Sandusky
Co C 125th NYSVI
Esperance, NY

bob 125th nysvi
07-25-2006, 08:37 PM
Well ,
I guess my question has been answered, Issued probably not. But I do love my hardee hat and I have a kepi I like alot. Niether of which would be issued to my unit, both would have been purchased privately or stolen:D
Here's the next question were Forage caps issued or kepis ? I have heard it both ways but seen that Forage caps were issued and kepis were bought?

the 125th NY was issued forage caps, always and our unit regs forbid anything else.

Even the captain wears 'em

Bob Sandusky
Co C 125th NYSVI
Esperance, NY