Federal Officers Sack Coat Question

[Sarah Jane Meister]

I am in the middle of making my husband his long overdue federal sack coat but am wondering how to do the side seams/back. I am using Charlie Childs pattern for an enlisted sack but am extending the length and adding pockets to the front. Just extending the length down seems that it would be rather tight around the legs and inhibit walking when my husband wears this. I was wondering if period officers sack coats had vents at either side seams or back seam to aid in ease of movement? I've looked through the Echoes of Glory book but have not found an answer to my question since usually it only shows the front of a garment there. I need to get this done by Friday.

Thanks,
Sarah

[Ken]

I am in the middle of making my husband his long overdue federal sack coat but am wondering how to do the side seams/back. I am using Charlie Childs pattern for an enlisted sack but am extending the length and adding pockets to the front. Just extending the length down seems that it would be rather tight around the legs and inhibit walking when my husband wears this. I was wondering if period officers sack coats had vents at either side seams or back seam to aid in ease of movement? I've looked through the Echoes of Glory book but have not found an answer to my question since usually it only shows the front of a garment there. I need to get this done by Friday.

Thanks,
Sarah
Sarah,

I have an officers sack coat made from an orginal and their is a large vent in the rare of the coat that can be opened and closed by a brass coin button. The sack overall shouldn't fit too snugly. Mine is looser then my enlisted sack.

[Ross L. Lamoreaux]

I've seen two examples that had a large (10-12 inch) vent in the center back, without any buttons or closures. If you are considering altering an existing pattern to lengthen , lengthen it on the center fronts and backs of the pattern rather than the bottom end. This will keep it from getting tighter at the bottom. The officers sack coat was a private purchase item, so there were as many variations as there were tailors. When looking at the images available of period officers in that attire, I think you will find that most (of course not all) were much looser fit and longer than the enlisted fatigue blouse. One thing that I have yet to see on an original officers blouse was the rounded "clamshell" type vented cuffs that were placed on the enlisted versions. You may want to consider making the officers coat with functional button cuffs, another feature in many I've seen.

[Sarah Jane Meister]

My problem is that I do not know where to look to find pictures of original officer sack coats. Usually when I am making something I have a file of pictures to refer to during the process, but for this particular project I don't have any exept some of officers actually wearing them, but none show detail well at all and I don't want to go by pictures of reproductions on various merchant sites. I have been looking online all day and in the books we have, none of the pictures are especially clear. I already have the coat body cut out but not the sleeves yet. For extending the body I followed the slant of the seam I was extending, so I didn't box it off, it shouldn't be tighter at the bottom than it is at the original pattern edge. Should the sleeves be cut totally plain with an overlap at the back seam for buttons/buttonholes, or was there any sort of cuff. On David's frock coat, I remember I had to make a 3" wide or so cuff that went all the way around the coat sleeve. (I forget the exact measurement since it was over 2 years ago I made that).

The rear vent sounds good, I can do that. I don't think the coat will be especially tight around the legs, but after looking at it the pieces today I thought a vent would be nice since my husband has unusually large thighs. Well, he is a big guy anyway.

Thanks, this is a huge help.

Sarah

[Regimental_Officer]

I've seen two examples that had a large (10-12 inch) vent in the center back, without any buttons or closures. If you are considering altering an existing pattern to lengthen , lengthen it on the center fronts and backs of the pattern rather than the bottom end. This will keep it from getting tighter at the bottom. The officers sack coat was a private purchase item, so there were as many variations as there were tailors. When looking at the images available of period officers in that attire, I think you will find that most (of course not all) were much looser fit and longer than the enlisted fatigue blouse. One thing that I have yet to see on an original officers blouse was the rounded "clamshell" type vented cuffs that were placed on the enlisted versions. You may want to consider making the officers coat with functional button cuffs, another feature in many I've seen.

I agree with Ross. I never saw any Officers sack coats that had non-fuctional button cuffs. The 2 originals i have seen and held both had fuctional button cuffs on the sleeves. Here is a tip about the length. If your going to lengthen a pattern base it on how many buttons your using if it is going to be a 5 button sack measure between the 3rd and 4th button measurments and add that to get the measurment for the 5th button and then add the same measurement on the botton from the fifth to finish of the coat.

[tpallas]

I recommend you seek out Jim Ruley on the Sewing Academy:

http://www.thesewingacademy.org/

In fact his post goes through making an officer's sack:

http://thesewingacademy.org/index.php?topic=670.0

Hope this helps.

[LibertyHallVols]

I recommend you seek out Jim Ruley on the Sewing Academy:

http://www.thesewingacademy.org/

In fact his post goes through making an officer's sack:

http://thesewingacademy.org/index.php?topic=670.0

Hope this helps.

I would heed Messr Pallas' advice. I am currently making a sack coat from one of Jim Ruley's patterns (well... actually, I'm on a break from it now in favor of more urgent projects). It is quite different from a Fed enlisted sack, probably closer to a civilian garment.

There are numerous original pics of Federal officers wearing these coats. Fit ranges from rather loose to more fitted. Lengths can be as short as the enlisted fatigue blouse, or extend almost to the knees. Mine is more the latter and will feature a velvet collar.

Here's a couple pics:
http://memory.loc.gov/service/pnp/cwpb/03800/03852r.jpg

http://www.authentic-campaigner.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=10173&d=1210622777

[Sarah Jane Meister]

Thank you!! I had thought there was a thread on Jim Ruley's making an officers sack, but for the life of me couldn't find it when I was searching the SA yesterday.

The pictures help a lot. David was very picky about what I had done when he got home last night. The length is just a bit longer than the enlisted length, the fit is overall loose but not really baggy so he liked that. He was very displeasured about the vent so much to my despair I must sew it up.

Functional buttons it shall be then, even though that means more buttonhole making for me. . .


thank you,
Sarah

[Forquer]

Jim did my private purchase sack, as well as the frock for my officer's rig and the work is outstanding. He is outright anal (and I mean that in a good way), for lack of a better term, in his detail.

You could do much worse than to heed any advice that he has to give.

[jurgitemvaletem]

I would like to echo what others have said concerning Mr. Ruly. He is actualy a member of my home unit. He has made all of my clothing that I have bothered wearing. I simply don't trust any one else!

Jim is a very helpful fellow and I am sure that he would be happy to lend a hand with your project.

[Forquer]

Below are images of my Ruley private purchase sack, to include top button fastened, unfastened, rear, and 2 shots of the vent.

[jurgitemvaletem]

Below are images of my Ruley private purchase sack, to include top button fastened, unfastened, rear, and 2 shots of the vent.


And how strapping you look in it Greg! Know of any one with pictures from last weekend?

[LibertyHallVols]

Sarah,

Here is a copy of an enlisted man's fatigue blouse modified for use by an officer. This was for sale on the A-C a while back, reportedly made by Chris Daley, copied from a coat in the Gettysburg NPS collection.

http://www.authentic-campaigner.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=8962&d=1205368613
http://www.authentic-campaigner.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=8963&d=1205368905

Just another possibility for you to ponder for your husband's coat.

Again, best of luck to you!

[Sarah Jane Meister]

Thank you for the additional info/pictures. I had everything done last night except for the sleeves, my husband got home and. . .he doesn't like the shape of the collar. The pattern for the collar included in the pattern has a rounded edge and he wants a square edge. And there a few minor wrinkles at the shoulder seam, despite fitting for the shoulder before he left for work yesterday morning. So I have to take it all apart and redo it. It is the curse of being married to this man. . .everything I make for him, I swear, I have to redo at least three times until it suits his perfectionistic nature.

I appreciate the help you all have been, I think it has saved me a lot of trouble.

Sarah

[Pvt Schnapps]

Sarah,

Here is a copy of an enlisted man's fatigue blouse modified for use by an officer. This was for sale on the A-C a while back, reportedly made by Chris Daley, copied from a coat in the Gettysburg NPS collection.

http://www.authentic-campaigner.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=8962&d=1205368613
http://www.authentic-campaigner.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=8963&d=1205368905

Just another possibility for you to ponder for your husband's coat.

Again, best of luck to you!


There had been some discussion several months ago about the wearing of enlisted clothing by officers with the gist of it being, as I recall, that it wasn't authorized, and that the "common soldier's blouse" sometimes referred to as worn in the field by officers was almost invariably a private purchase sack.

At the time I thought otherwise, but couldn't find a source. Little did I know it was right in front of me in the Regs., No. 1166:

"Officers of the army may purchase, at the regulation price, from the quartermaster of their post, such articles of uniform clothing as they actually need -- certifying that the articles so drawn are intended solely for their personal use."

Since the quartermaster would only have enlisted clothing on hand (the army didn't make or procure officer's clothing), this assumes and legitimizes the wearing of enlisted clothing by officers, including the example shown, which was possibly altered by the company tailor (just one more under-represented impression :) ).