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Asa_Trenchard
05-10-2006, 10:12 PM
We are reenactors. Reenactors who have become slightly frustrated with certain aspects of our avocation. We have formed the Trenchard Society to address those frustrations.

Since the centennial reenactments, reenactors have pretty much been the same. Uniforms have changed, authenticity standards have improved, and research in the material culture of the soldier has spawned it's own industry. The men in those uniforms, adhering to those standards, and performing that research have, however, stayed the same. We are human. We realize that after the battle on any given day, the rest of the time is ours. We wander off to the sutlery, sit around the fire and chat, and some just go straight to bed. RARELY is a serious guard mounted and the spectators, friends from "the other side", and our own men wander between the lines unhindered. When the guard is mounted it is hardly ever continued through the night.

We see this both as an authenticity issue and a security/safety issue.

As reenactors, we want to experience the soldier's life. What did the average soldier spend the vast majority of his time doing beyond drill and watching grass grow? They stood guard. By ignoring that vital aspect we are missing an integral part of the experience we strive so hard to achieve. It's boring, tedious, and frustrating. It's also a large part of the soldier's experience.

As citizens in a post 9/11 world, the utter lack of security in the remote places we usually find ourselves camping has become a great concern. We tend to rely on the event organizers for security. Why? 70% of all security incidents are perpetrated by those on the inside of an organization. This is not to say that we should not trust them. We are saying that defense-in-depth might not be a bad thing.

So, what to do? In every theatre of the war, spies were universally hated. They discovered troop movements. They discovered troop strengths. They stole or destroyed vital military resources. Spies plied their trade by exploiting the weaknesses in an Army's defenses. The soft underbelly if you will. Now, we would never sully our, as yet unknown, reputation by associating our name with the sinister label of "spy" but it seems there is a job to be done.

Commanders, your camps are no longer "safe". Whether you are participating in a local event as commander or at a National as Commander, your camps are no longer safe "after hours". If you should receive in your pocket, on your desk, in your bedding, or anywhere else *our calling card you will know immediately that your guards have failed you and you have met with a rather ignoble "end". You will, of course, continue on with your responsibilities to your men, the event, and the sponsors. After the event you should come to our blog to see how you met your fate.

Clearly, we are not advocating anything even remotely threatening to you as individuals, the armies you command, or the hobby in general. We simply wish to add an element to the experience that has never, to our knowledge, been attempted. Check our blog for the rules we fully intend to follow along with more details of our rather unique "impression".

The Trenchard Society
http://trenchardsociety.blogspot.com/

[* edited- replaced "shiney black minie ball" with "our calling card". Our intent is to expose weakness, not sow true fear. Our apologies]

bill watson
05-11-2006, 09:41 AM
My only remotely applicable thought is that if folks don't care to begin with, they won't care after they get a black ball -- it takes two teams to play a game, and you're only one team.

The only people playing the game are the ones who DO have guard mount through the night. If you play your game there, chagrin at getting a black ball might mean something. But even at those events, given that there's at best a regiment rather than an entire army, your black ball would count for something only if you actually came through the line of pickets undetected and could prove it. Ronald McDonald could come in through the rear unchallenged.

And if you think guard mount matters but didn't know there are units and events that set all-night guard mounts, complete with supports and patrols, you may be -- dare I say it? -- Still Going To The Wrong Events.

MStuart
05-11-2006, 09:58 AM
Yyyyyyaaaaaaaaaawwwwwwwwwwnnnnnnnnnnnn!!!!!!!!!

He'll never be able to do it in my tent (not that I command anything), the alarm will go off when he trips over all my "mainstream" stuff. Plus, if he happens to startle my wife, the little girl from S.C. is liable to put his minnie ball someplace it'll take a team of surgeons to remove.

Are we supposed to thank this guy for something?

Mark

BobSzabo
05-11-2006, 10:36 AM
Most events do not allow minnie' balls to be brought on site. Your black minnie' ball might get you "black" listed from a lot of events.

Also a number if years ago some people ending up doing real jail time for sneaking into camps at night to steal battle flags. Id be very careful sneaking around in someones camp after hours. Some people take it very seriously.

Remise
05-11-2006, 10:56 AM
Yes, well, we really need to improve upon our authenticity, and who better to turn to for inspiration but the Society for Creative Anachronism?

I like this rule from the Trenchard Society's Web site:

1) In all things, we will avoid physical injury at all costs both to ourselves and our adversaries. If discovered and caught, we will struggle to free ourselves from your clutches but not to the point of throwing blows or using weapons. Consider it a grand wrestling match.

==========

As we all know, nobody ever got hurt while wrestling in a tent filled with muskets, bayonets, and other gear. It's unlikely I will find a Minie ball in my dog tent, but if I find anybody sneaking around in our camp when I return to it, my first assumption is that this person will be a thief, and I would guess a lot of others would feel the same -- and perhaps act accordingly.

I think the entire concept of this group -- which may be just one person, and could be just a delayed April Fool's prank -- to be extremely dangerous, both to the organizer/s and his or their potential victims.


B.C. Milligan

MStuart
05-11-2006, 11:00 AM
If I find a black minnie ball in my pants I'll just die.

Mark On my toes at all times...............now

tompritchett
05-11-2006, 11:48 AM
I was aware that the responsible parties were thrown off the site and the officer in charge was black-balled from many events (I remember seeing him having to pack up at the same event one or two years later when he used his middle name to register and was then discovered), but I was not aware that anyone actually was criminally charged. Could you provide more details.

tompritchett
05-11-2006, 11:54 AM
As we all know, nobody ever got hurt while wrestling in a tent filled with muskets, bayonets, and other gear. It's unlikely I will find a Minie ball in my dog tent, but if I find anybody sneaking around in our camp when I return to it, my first assumption is that this person will be a thief, and I would guess a lot of others would feel the same -- and perhaps act accordingly.
B.C. Milligan
I have been at events where muskets were stolen either out of the tents or from the sutlers. In the case where the theft was from a sulter, the thiefs were caught and arrested. I have also read on the forums where individuals have had equipment stolen from their vehicles. So, thievery is a very real threat in this hobby. While I applaude the idea of adding another dimension of realism and authenticity to the hobby, I am very concerned that this effort could lead to some very serious misunderstandings that could quickly escalate into serious trouble.

My 2 cents.

Michael Pierpoint
05-11-2006, 11:58 AM
I agree with everbody so far, HUGE RED FLAG. The thing you have mentioned
can get you throwed out of event and possiblely even arrested. You would do well to do somthing better with your time than to play covert operation at CW. event. Besides why would one give a minie ball to someone that has a rifle and blackpowder............ think about it? Their plenty of other stange people out here besides yourself. Yes I do found this stange

Michael Pierpoint

BobSzabo
05-11-2006, 12:05 PM
Tom,

Years ago a group went into camp at Cedar Creek and took a flag. I think the flag actually had some historic significance. They got a bit carried away when they also also went to Harpers Ferry and I think took some muskets too.

Big, mistake doing that on Federal Property.

I dont know all of the details but thats what I know about it.

indguard
05-11-2006, 12:47 PM
All that talk about human nature as if they have a CLUE what it is and he ends with...


Clearly, we are not advocating anything even remotely threatening to you as individuals, the armies you command, or the hobby in general. We simply wish to add an element to the experience that has never, to our knowledge, been attempted.

This is CLEARLY not true. Should this little "society" get bigger and get more adherents it would CLEARLY become a threat to everything everyone does, for if we DON'T follow these guys' little rules we WILL find them INTRUDING on our commands to FORCE us to do so!

I am also amused by all the threatening language, yet they claim to want to only be "improving" things.

Let us hope this is just one "Hardkewel" going off his nut and that he doesn't really have anyone helping him with this nonsense. It is a recipe for disaster, is adversarial and confrontational and WILL cause suspicions, and fights. But then, being adversarial, confrontational and argumentative ... that is what a "Hardkewel" is all about, now ISN'T it?

-Warner Todd Huston

Frenchie
05-11-2006, 01:23 PM
I find myself approving of the basic idea, just not this kind of implementation. I've long advocated the mounting of camp guards to provide fire and security watches, information to spectators and lost reenactors, traffic and crowd control, etc.

I know people in the SCA and have heard of the Dark Horde. From what I've heard from admittedly biased members, they don't seem to be as effective as this gentleman might have us believe. I don't think this Trenchard Society is going to become a major force in CW reenacting, but we'll see.

In the meantime, I'd caution Mr. Trenchard with a quote from Benjamin Franklin: "Three can keep a secret as long as two are dead." A word to the wise, sir: Spies - and counterspies - can be found everywhere. The Trenchard Society should look to its own security as well as that of its "victims".

TimKindred
05-11-2006, 01:35 PM
Fellers,

There's also an old Navy tradition of throwing a "blanket party" for suspected thieves and other ne're-do-wells. Just something for him to think about. This fellow who posted this had the same thread removed from the A/C forum.

Personally, if I ever found one of his little 'markers' amongst my gear, then he had better hope to God he has a ******************** of a lawyer. I won't play games with a little pissant like him.

Respects,

MStuart
05-11-2006, 01:37 PM
Aren't some of us taking this a little too seriously?

Who in their right mind is gonna cough up and admit they got a black ball in their pants? And who gives a flying feces if Asa puts it in his blog?

Come on now, step back and take a deep breath about this. If 'ol Asa was trying to rile some fellers up, he sure got his wish. Shouldn't we worry more about the aliens and flying discs up at Area 51?

Mark

TimKindred
05-11-2006, 02:03 PM
Mark,

As someone who had a weapon and accoutrements stolen at an event, I take these little cretins seriously. If he is so anal about how this hobby is run, and how he's going to rewrite all the rules we play by, then who knows what else he's capable of. I'm not willing to take that risk, and neither should anyone else.

I have already filed a complaint with his blog service provider about his content being threatening and in violation of his service agreement with them. I encourage others to do the same.

Respects,

tompritchett
05-11-2006, 02:13 PM
Oh, I am very familiar with the incidence as the guilty parties were from a sister battalion to my old battalion at the time. In fact, a patrol from our battalion, if I remember correctly (that d*mn CRS again) commanded by another member of this forum, had just linked up with the commander of the guilty group during the morning tactic when a staff officer form Bair rode up and informed us all about how the s**t was hitting the fan over the incidence. Immediately afterwards, the guilty commander left to go back to his camp supposedly for the purpose of returning the flags. Unfortunately for him, before he would have had a chance to reach camp, we heard the police arrive with their sirens.

The reason I was asking, I knew of the Valley Division investigation into the event (I was interviewed by investigator, who was, and still is, a close friend). the expulsion of the guilty parties from the Cedar Creek event and from Valley Division, as well as the blacklisting of the commander from ever attending another Cedar Creek event, but I had not heard that anyone actually went to jail over the instance - not that I am implying one way or another that it indeed occurred. I was just curious as to your source of the information. Thanks.

Chuck A Luck
05-11-2006, 02:29 PM
Let us hope this is just one "Hardkewel" going off his nut and that he doesn't really have anyone helping him with this nonsense. It is a recipe for disaster, is adversarial and confrontational and WILL cause suspicions, and fights. But then, being adversarial, confrontational and argumentative ... that is what a "Hardkewel" is all about, now ISN'T it?

Frankly, "hoping" it's a "hardkewel" seems a bit "adversarial, confrontational and argumentative" to me. But maybe that's just me. Personally, I'd hope it's just a nut... "going off his nut" with some crazy idea.

bill watson
05-11-2006, 03:24 PM
"Aren't some of us taking this a little too seriously?"

Yeah.

It's probably kids.

There is some value to having your lines challenged. Adds a dimension to the overnight experience, especially when you get to question the folks rounded up when it happens.

But this kind of freelance thing is just going to get somebody's face punched or whatever.

captdougofky
05-11-2006, 03:29 PM
I had a rifle stolen five years ago at Scremento Kentucky, Nathan B. Forrest first action in the war. What you are wanting to do is something I would give some thought to. It was not a Springfield but a hand built longrifle that I had taken to show a friend who into custom weapons. valued at about 12 hundred dollars, to make a long story short if I every catch the person, a health issue is whats involved. Do what you want but I'd come up with something else to do with my nights.

Doug
Lyons Battery
Kentucky

hanktrent
05-11-2006, 06:06 PM
As reenactors, we want to experience the soldier's life. What did the average soldier spend the vast majority of his time doing beyond drill and watching grass grow? They stood guard.

Anyone else catch the irony? They say they want to experience the soldier's life, but the "solution" they're proposing is not to spend events sharing picket duty themselves, but to go sneaking off playing spy. Uh huh. Running around leaving black minie balls was a big part of most soldiers' lives. Yep, that'll increase the accuracy of their experience.

Hank Trent
hanktrent@voyager.net

indguard
05-11-2006, 06:48 PM
Charles,


Frankly, "hoping" it's a "hardkewel" seems a bit "adversarial, confrontational and argumentative" to me

Assuming, for the basis of argument, that you, Mr. Kibler, consider yourself a "hardcore" reenactor (or do you say "enactor"?) ...

You stand, objecting to my usage of the term "Hardkewel" in a derogatory way in my post. I find this highly amusing as I'd guess that you indiscriminately use the word "Farb" to describe anyone whom you feel doesn't measure up to your personal standards!

It is easily understood that the "Hardkewel" is no better than the unrepentant "Farb", and I am incredulous that you are so up in arms over its appearance on this thread. When even the Hardcore community uses the word "Hardkewel" in a derogatory way, I find it amusing that you object to my usage of it.

Perhaps it's the zealots who refuse to recognize the extremists in their OWN backyard, who so sad?

-WTH

indguard
05-11-2006, 06:51 PM
Uh huh. Running around leaving black minie balls was a big part of most soldiers' lives. Yep, that'll increase the accuracy of their experience.

Ha, ha. Good one.

I wonder if the Quartermaster can get us all some black minnie balls? If'n we ALL had 'em, then no one would know if one was left for them or not!

Chuck A Luck
05-11-2006, 07:58 PM
Assuming, for the basis of argument, that you, Mr. Kibler, consider yourself a "hardcore" reenactor (or do you say "enactor"?) ...
Bad assumption, actually.


You stand, objecting to my usage of the term "Hardkewel" in a derogatory way in my post. I find this highly amusing as I'd guess that you indiscriminately use the word "Farb" to describe anyone whom you feel doesn't measure up to your personal standards

WTH, all I was objecting to (finding offensive, whatever) was your statement where you said you were "hoping it was a hardkewel" responsible for this (IMHO) silly "trenchard society" thing. For the record, I'd have found it equally offensive if you said you "hoped it was a farb." And no, I don't go around calling people "farbs." And I don't really want to argue about this, just wanted to try to straighten that out. :)

Asa_Trenchard
05-11-2006, 11:10 PM
Calm down Gentlemen,

We have been reenacting for 15 years or so and have worked with all of the "philosophical branches". Several issues you kind folks have raised are address below:

Skulking around: No skulking at all. If we are challenged at all we'll have to walk away. Strangers in your camps should be challenged at all costs and directed to their destination, escorted through your camps.

Wrestling in a tent: Won't happen. If any of our Agents are inside your tent then they are WAY out of line anyway and deserve the beating you offer them. If, however, they can stand under your fly and toss our card on your bedding...well...that's another matter entirely. We will respect the privacy and sanctity of your private quarters.

Trent's Irony: We may well BE on guard duty or who knows what. We may well be in your ranks. ;) As we said, we are reenactors like the rest of you. We simply want to see our OWN security improved through the use of historically accurate devices. Are our means "hardkewel" accurate? No, they are not. If they were we would all be going to jail and no one wants that.

We are definately not "hardkewel". We don't have the temperament for such nonsense as squabbling over clothes when what SHOULD be important is the mindset anyway. We are not taking ourselves so seriously as some of you may think. For us, this is a grand game. If you catch us and we cannot SAFELY make our escape, then you have us. We expect to be treated as spies of the day would have been treated....minus all the blood letting of course.

We read this thread and see it already deteriorating into the reenactor "class warfare" that has plaqued our avocation for several years. Sad.

Asa_Trenchard
05-11-2006, 11:14 PM
And as to the AC thread being dropped, we expected it would be. Those folks have no sense of humor, and for that our account will probably be killed altogether and that's fine too. We recognize it's a privilege for us to participate in these forums and said privilege may be revoked at the whim of Mr. Szabo or whoever is the High Potentate on the AC now.

Asa_Trenchard
05-11-2006, 11:37 PM
Mr. Watson,

Oh we are certain that there are some events that run full guard mounts. It was an experience at one of these events that truly formed our idea. We are also aware that there are some groups that won't give a hoot about their glaring lack of internal security. These are the same groups that then complain to local law enforcement when their gear get's stolen.


My only remotely applicable thought is that if folks don't care to begin with, they won't care after they get a black ball -- it takes two teams to play a game, and you're only one team.

The only people playing the game are the ones who DO have guard mount through the night. If you play your game there, chagrin at getting a black ball might mean something. But even at those events, given that there's at best a regiment rather than an entire army, your black ball would count for something only if you actually came through the line of pickets undetected and could prove it. Ronald McDonald could come in through the rear unchallenged.

And if you think guard mount matters but didn't know there are units and events that set all-night guard mounts, complete with supports and patrols, you may be -- dare I say it? -- Still Going To The Wrong Events.

Asa_Trenchard
05-11-2006, 11:43 PM
Most events do not allow minnie' balls to be brought on site. Your black minnie' ball might get you "black" listed from a lot of events.

Also a number if years ago some people ending up doing real jail time for sneaking into camps at night to steal battle flags. Id be very careful sneaking around in someones camp after hours. Some people take it very seriously.

That is an excellent point Mr. Szabo and something we HAVE reconsidered. We will update our information to reflect a more period way of making our presence known, the use of calling cards with all appropriate calling card etiquette.

The last thing we need in reenacting is another nutball dropping spurious black balls around. It appears our "Fear, Uncertainty, and Doubt" quotient is through the roof already so there's no need to exacerbate the situation.

Our apologies for not making the correction before initially posting.

See lads? We aren't out to rifle through your frilly things and DEFINATELY don't want to seriously scare anyone. We love this business like the rest of you. Mr. Kindred's fear we hope to assuage. His threats to our blog are worthy of our consideration.

Frenchie
05-12-2006, 12:29 AM
Busted! That he didn't think it through is apparent from his backpedaling - projectiles are banned from most (if not all) events and if he were the experienced reenactor he claims to be, he'd have known that.

I think Mr. T. has gotten a loud, clear message, and we won't find many "calling cards" on our cots, especially since most of us don't use cots, and those who do don't give a hoot about it because they're mostly insensitive to criticism anyway.

I think what we have here is a young man, quite full of himself and frustrated with those who don't hang on every pearl of wisdom that drops from his lips. He's found what he thinks is a clever, high-toned way to stir up the pot. If he's half as smart as he thinks he is, he'll learn the lesson that he's being given by the Law of Unintended Consequences.

indguard
05-12-2006, 01:57 AM
If he's half as smart as he thinks he is, he'll learn the lesson that he's being given by the Law of Unintended Consequences.

... just to clear that statement up for Mr. Isa Tankard, merely because I don't give him as much credit as Mr.Frenchie did...

The "Unintended Consequences" will be as follows...

1) People find out exactly who you are
2) People don't take kindly to your "help"
3) People decide your a trouble making jerk
4) People ban you from events, and/or make sure you feel unwelcome
5) Your "great" ideas set back the hobby even further
6) You end up taking up golf and leaving the hobby

Jess tryin' ter help.
;)

-WTH

Michael Pierpoint
05-12-2006, 08:57 AM
Asa

As innocent as you think this is, it is as you stated post 911. People sneaking around being in a camp that they have NO business in. I understand you or trying to be friendly here. When I see sombody in my camp walking though that I do not know, I wonder are their scoping me out to come back later and steal from us. When I first started in this hobby some years ago stealing and the like was hardly heard of. Now it seems its becoming more common.Yes you have stated you are not about this but I don't know you and many others don't either. And this is why I question your motives. I can see where this could be fun with one's pards but the unsuspecting reenactor to me would be disrespective. If the proper people at event know about this before hand, such as the coordinator, commanding officers maybe that could be different. What about the people that do not want to be apart of this? This is a hobbyand to some away of life. I am sure some people will be ok with this others such as myself there are many red flags. Things could happen that are not intended. People could be hurt, embarassed that are not intended. Would they think this hobby is fun now.
Remeber this is post 911. You pobabley think I'am reading to much into this,but I wonder are you thinking this though.

Regards
Michael Pierpoint

ilfed104
05-12-2006, 01:38 PM
along the line someone is going to Mr. Trenchard a good old-fashioned backyard beatdown. I'd pay to see that, not much, but I'd pay.

Spinster
05-12-2006, 05:39 PM
Now that Mr. T. seems to have rethought the 'minnie ball' thing, I'd recommend that he consider something along the lines of what we left when presented with the task of getting through a guard and picket line..........

I was supposed to leave a pretty girl if sucessful--timing was a bit off, so we left a pair of ladies drawers instead..... and the time before that, one of our ladies delivered a full set of hand drawn maps with troop counts, of both armies......and the time before that.......

Sorry sir, its been done.............and by a bunch of frilly girls no less.

If your calling card looks anything like a period one, about the only commentary it will provoke is the one that is always in my head after an event " I wonder who gave me this card, and what am I supposed to remember to send them?"

indguard
05-12-2006, 06:42 PM
..Man! talk about gettin' beat up from all sides! Now, even the ladies is whackin' ol Isa Tankard around!

We should start a poll...

-Should Isa Tankard just slink off into the night never to be heard from again?

Yea?

or

Nay?
;)

MStuart
05-12-2006, 10:58 PM
Why don't we just let 'ol Asa drift off into the four winds? In his mind, he thought he had a good idea and might make folks put out guards on the company streets to add authenticity. He obviously doesn't know that at most "mainstream" events, that ain't gonna happen (what with all the keggers and rowdiness going on). Now, if he wants to be "authentic", there are other events............... (that's a joke, folks)

Mark

JW&CO
05-13-2006, 09:40 AM
With the recent string of home invasions here in the NYC metro area, tent invasions at events may not go over to well. Not being a lawyer or police officer, but wouldn't this fall under tresspassing and invasion of privacy? Maybe criminal mischief? Up here in the NYC metro area we tend to be very into personal space. They say the average person needs at least 3 feet around them to feel comfortable, here it is more like 20. I would advise against this at events in the north east.

MStuart
05-13-2006, 11:45 AM
With too much time on my hands, I checked out my handy-dandy Pa. Crimes Code. Taking everything into consideration, (the Societies' web-site, etc. and what and why Asa and his boys say they are doing) about the only crime in Pa. that applies is Harassment. But that's pushing it. You'd have a tough time getting a conviction, let alone a physical arrest for someone playing spy at a reenactment. Property damage and theft are different stories, though.

That'll be $75 for 1/2 hour's work, as my stinkin' lawyer friends would say. (No offense to the fine corporate, civil, and agricultural attorney's on our fine board) :.)

Mark

Curt-Heinrich Schmidt
05-13-2006, 12:20 PM
Hallo!

Announcing The Trencher Society.
Our members plan on sneaking into tents and replacing Dinty Moore Beef Stew, Twinkies, Pop Tarts, and Coca-cola in coolers with hardtack and salt pork...

Seriously, as already shared, if one wants a more "historically faithful" experience such as those that include Guard Mount, etc., then IMHO, one should consider attending the types of events, and with units or messes, that embrace that level or degree of "historical faithfulness" one needs or desires.
Rather than going to a Chinese restaurant and seeking taco's...
Each to their own Mental Picture.

Curt-Heinrich Schmidt
Ho-Ho Mess

tompritchett
05-13-2006, 02:14 PM
Interestingly enough,in my old battalion, which was by no means even close to being considered authentic, at the larger events my battalion commander would indeed mount a "guard mount", very analologus to a modern military fire watch such as there no SGT of CPL of the Guard and the Guard going off shift woke up their replacements, to watch for thiefs to make sure that the Lady civilians were not harassed by drunks to and from the porta-potties.

Frenchie
05-13-2006, 07:47 PM
Rather than going to a Chinese restaurant and seeking taco's...
Curt-Heinrich Schmidt

Actually, Herr Schmidt, our favorite local "Great Wall" buffet has taco makings in the American foods section. :cool:

And now I think Mr. T.'s thread has degraded far enough to convince him, if he's still reading it, that he'll have to grow up some to be taken seriously, at least around here.

Asa_Trenchard
05-14-2006, 12:41 AM
Interestingly enough,in my old battalion, which was by no means even close to being considered authentic, at the larger events my battalion commander would indeed mount a "guard mount", very analologus to a modern military fire watch such as there no SGT of CPL of the Guard and the Guard going off shift woke up their replacements, to watch for thiefs to make sure that the Lady civilians were not harassed by drunks to and from the porta-potties.

...and that is all we are looking for Mr. Pritchett. It's the mainstream events we are most concerned about really. As others have stated, albeit insultingly, the AoP types of events already mount a guard so their camps will be very difficult to penetrate. This year alone we have been to at least 5 mainstream style events where locals were wandering around camps LONG after hours unchallenged. For the folks here that believe WE are the thieves, it's the LOCALS you have to be concerned with, not us. The vast majority of local spectators are well meaning folks. But with every community, there are miscreants. Without a firewatch or Guard Mount you camps are wide open to theft, harrassment of your wives, girlfriends, and other "significant others".

Ah well, your threats of physical violence, legal action against us, and petty remarks do not deter us. Many of our male members are married so we are used to such behavior. ;)

Fear not enlistedmen, we are not interested in you. It's your commanders that will receive cards.

So, let the flames begin(again).

tompritchett
05-14-2006, 01:28 AM
Actually, while the locals can be a source of many of the thievery problems, it was drunken reenactors that our guards were protecting our women from - many of whom were under age to begin with. Bill Watson was so right many months ago about raising this particular issue. One of these days it is going to raise up and bite some battalion commander and event coordinators hard in a place where the sum does not shine.

tompritchett
05-14-2006, 01:30 AM
And now I think Mr. T.'s thread has degraded far enough to convince him, if he's still reading it, that he'll have to grow up some to be taken seriously, at least around here.
Apparently not.

Frenchie
05-14-2006, 10:31 AM
Apparently not.

He's got a hard head, Tom. Hey, we'll see how many COs actually get the cards - if any, the chances are they won't mention it, especially if they care. This thing may well be doomed to die of ennui and neglect.

Mr. T. may be tempted to come back and say he's not looking for publicity or fame or notoriety, but if that's so, why has he made such a noise to begin with? I think if he doesn't care to be noticed except by his high-ranking victims, this thread wouldn't exist, because very few big bugs read these forums. Again, if he was as savvy and experienced a reenactor as he wants us to think he is, he'd have known that, just as he'd have known that real Miniť balls aren't allowed at events.

Hee hee hee. bus-ted... again...:lol:

Luke MacGillie
05-14-2006, 11:52 AM
I think you should seriously invest in some Level 4 body armor, you never know who might be packin real iron in the bottom of their haversack, Post 9/11 security concerns and all, Nationwide CCW for all sworn LEOs ect............................................... ..........

Spinster
05-15-2006, 12:10 PM
Actually, while the locals can be a source of many of the thievery problems, it was drunken reenactors that our guards were protecting our women from - many of whom were under age to begin with. Bill Watson was so right many months ago about raising this particular issue. One of these days it is going to raise up and bite some battalion commander and event coordinators hard in a place where the sum does not shine.

Now that, Mr. P is a more than excellent idea.

As a civilian, I've often ended up camping in some remote sites, either because I was trying to remove myself from the rowdyness of military camps, or because I got a blank look when I'd ask where the designated civilian area was located.

And, with a tent full of teenage girls, that was sometimes a really really bad idea, especially with the need to make any nighttime trips to the portas with all girls up, dressed, and traveling together.

It did however start me down the fascinating road of collecting chamber pots. We just don't go out after dusk--and are well armed should someone decide to come in.

I have, however, always wondered what happened to the guy who did decide to come in about a decade or so ago---- that I whacked upside the head with pan full of warm grease and simmering peas around 3:00 am. He staggered off, rather bloody and greasy and wet. Never heard another word about it, and nobody ever said they found a body or were missing a soldier.

Anytime I encounter a somewhat addled 'long-time-experienced-reenactor' with some sort of hare-brained scheme going, I assume this may be the whackee...........

Wild Rover
05-15-2006, 03:05 PM
Asa,

Don't register for any of my events, thanks.

And WTH,

Mr Kibler is one of the best reenactors and genuine pards out there, he does many events that run the scale from both ends...so keep a lid on your fear of harcores.

Because we are out to ruin your hobby. Not the hobby as a whole, just yours. No one else's.

Boo.

indguard
05-15-2006, 06:36 PM
Mr. Anders,


Mr Kibler is one of the best reenactors and genuine pards out there..

What makes you think I feel otherwise? I DID say, "For the sake of argument" in that post. I do not know Mr. Kibler and make no judgments on him in particular. I was talking about the dreaded "Hardkewel", not necessarily Mr. Kibler.

As an aside, though, I am amused how the "Hardcores" like to run away from that label as fast as they can. Curious, that.


Because we are out to ruin your hobby. Not the hobby as a whole, just yours. No one else's.

I cannot imagine you having any impact on "my hobby" regardless of your intentions. I doubt we'd ever come in conflict... or even contact... anywhere other than a message board.

Look me up at Perryville. I might have a bottle of some homemade Cherry wine to sample. Bring an empty cup, some good cheer ... Just don't bring Pogue Mahone! (Ha, ha)

FWL
05-15-2006, 07:31 PM
We are reenactors. Reenactors who have become slightly frustrated with certain aspects of our avocation. We have formed the Trenchard Society to address those frustrations.


[* edited- replaced "shiney black minie ball" with "our calling card". Our intent is to expose weakness, not sow true fear. Our apologies]


Mr. Asa I find this whole business very odd. But I like your first name Asa. Biblical in nature? Perhaps I will adopt it as impression I'm thinking about. I going to my first event as a Confederate, how about Asa Walker from Rockbridge County, VA, student at Washington College.

Michael Pierpoint
05-15-2006, 09:41 PM
Asa

When you leave me a card make sure you have your address on it.



Thanks
Michael Pierpoint,

flattop32355
05-15-2006, 11:59 PM
And, with a tent full of teenage girls, that was sometimes a really really bad idea, especially with the need to make any nighttime trips to the portas with all girls up, dressed, and traveling together.

Please do not hesitate to ask the military to provide guards for you and yours, should a situation threaten or arise.

On a lighter note, I pity the poor fools who would challange you to try to take advantage of your charges at anything less than a 5-1 force ratio, and even then only with heavy artillery support.

Spinster
05-16-2006, 10:48 AM
You know, Mr. B, we haven't encountered a bit of trouble anywhere, ever since Mr. Crabb's axe somehow jumped into my hands and stayed there throughout NSA's Franklin event a few years back............

Some months later, I was at an event 5 states away, and got all bewildered that men I did not know were greeting me by name. I finally whispered to my companion " I don't understand this--I have not been formally introduced to any of these men". My escort replied "Oh, I think the fact that they marched by while you were standing in your yard holding an axe was enough of a formal introduction for this part of the country"

As for our chamber pot collection--I'm still laughing at an occurance earlier this spring--- a soldier, assigned to search our belongings, lifting the lid to a chamber pot, finding it full of soapy water, and picking up a stick to stir in it. The look on his face was as if he expected it to explode or something.......

Jim Dedman
05-16-2006, 02:29 PM
I think mounting a 24 real guard is a good idea. But the hazards after dark should consist of fire or vandals, not some guy pretending to be a spy. It just looks like trouble to me and as my mother used to say, "Somebody is going to get hurt."

Curt-Heinrich Schmidt
05-16-2006, 02:39 PM
Hallo!

It's all fun until someone loses an eye.
;-) (no pun on the emoticon intended...)
:-)

Curt-Heinrich Schmidt

bob 125th nysvi
05-16-2006, 08:03 PM
what they did to spies in the civil war, hang him that will solve both his problem and ours.

If Asa wants to do some 'real' soldier things he can STAND guard duty all night or pickett duty or wood detail or canteen detail or wash his clothes or clean his weapon or clean the captains weapon or take care of the officer's horse or etc.

All much more realistic than soldiers being spies.

Well my real question is where is Asa OFFICER in all of this or is Asa a free lance walk on? See if he has an officer than once he leaves the camp he's Awol and there are a lot of interesting punishments for that.

And if he's a free-lancer then there is a simple way to prevent trouble. Don't let free-lancers participate.

I refereed sports for years and every team had a trouble maker or loud mouth by applying a collective punishment (say a 15 yard unsportsman like conduct penalty) you'd be surprised after two of those how quickly a team reins in its own errant members.

No need to worry though I suspect Asa is all talk and no go, many internet people are.

You can always try me Asa but then you're going back to your camp sans pants and shoes.

Bob Sandusky
Co C 125th NYSVI
Esperance, NY

indguard
05-16-2006, 09:20 PM
HEY!

That's a point I didn't consider! Ol' Asa is telling us all how we ain't like REAL soldiers, yet he intends to wander around an event with no duties, no officer, no unit... how is HE being like a REAL soldier???