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MStuart
01-17-2007, 01:35 PM
Burned up over smoking ban, man arrested at bus station
Wednesday, January 17, 2007

By Torsten Ove, Pittsburgh Post-Gazette

An Armenian national who apparently didn't think much of anti-smoking laws blew cigarette smoke at a Pittsburgh police officer and ended up hit with a stun gun, arrested and jailed after a scuffle at the Greyhound bus terminal over the weekend.

Officer Walter Carlson said Suren Chukhadzhyan, 50, ignored his commands to stop smoking, leading to a fight at the Second Avenue facility that knocked over seats and sent other travelers scrambling.

After an employee complained that a man was refusing to obey the no-smoking policy, Officer Carlson responded and told Mr. Chukhadzhyan to move to a designated smoking area, according to a report.

"The actor ignored me and made a cocky smirk to me and was very arrogant," the officer said. "(He) turned away from me and continued to smoke."

When the officer ordered the man to turn around, he did, but blew smoke in the direction of the officer. Officer Carlson then grabbed the man's arm and said he would be cited, but he said Mr. Chukhadzhyan flicked his cigarette to the ground and walked away.

Inside the terminal, the officer said Mr. Chukhadzhyan sat down but "became agitated and clenched his fists and began to speak to himself in what appeared to be Russian."

When the man stood up and approached him aggressively, the officer said he pulled his Taser and warned, "This doesn't have to go this way."

But he said Mr. Chukhadzhyan said "arrest me" and shoved him. The officer zapped him with his Taser, but the prongs didn't penetrate the man's thick coat.

Mr. Chukhadzhyan charged.

An off-duty Duquesne police officer, Chad Stevens, then pulled his badge, identified himself and joined the fray. The two officers fought with Mr. Chukhadzhyan, pinned his arms and managed to cuff him after forcing him against a vending machine.

But even then, Officer Carlson said, he refused to get on the floor, so they tripped him to the ground.

Mr. Chukhadzhyan, who lives in Glendale, Calif., was charged with disorderly conduct, resisting arrest and aggravated assault.
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If you non-smokers weren't so sensitive, this poor guy wouldn't be a guest of ours here in the 'burgh. :-(

I remember the old days when you could still smoke at your desk. Handgun control can bugger off.......this is serious stuff here.

We don't want the government to interfere with our guns, but with our smoking it's okay? Hmmmmmm

Mark

sbl
01-17-2007, 02:06 PM
I remember my father's trach tube.

Pete K
01-17-2007, 02:28 PM
My father "went ot meet his" father at age 55 partly because of his love of cigars. But, as hard as it it is to say, he was an intelligent man and made a choice to smoke tobacco. I do not, my choice. I want to be around to meet my grandsons, my father didn't. I'm 44 and want to be around more than eleven years from now. Should the Commonwealth/
Allegheny County tell me how to make this choice??? I'm not sure. Tobacco is still a legal product, I do believe.

Malingerer
01-17-2007, 02:32 PM
Should the Commonwealth/
Allegheny County tell me how to make this choice???
Only when your smoke ends up in my lungs.
Peter Julius,
Bryson City, NC

Trooper Graham
01-17-2007, 02:49 PM
Man!!!!!!!!!! Have you opened a can of worms...........;)

MStuart
01-17-2007, 04:00 PM
Man!!!!!!!!!! Have you opened a can of worms...........;)

I know.....hindsight being 20/20, I shoulda stayed with gun control.

Sooooooooo...how 'bout those Colts?

Mark

Trooper Graham
01-17-2007, 04:16 PM
I know.....hindsight being 20/20, I shoulda stayed with gun control.

Sooooooooo...how 'bout those Colts?

Mark

Somehow the image of Bonnie and Clyde standing beside a stolen car, each holding a Thompson and smoking cigars...............come to mind.:rolleyes: :rolleyes:

bizzilizzit
01-17-2007, 04:42 PM
I remember my father's trach tube.

I helped my dad bury my step-mom a year ago - she accidently pulled out her trach-tube while alone as my dad ran an errand for her - she smoked for 20 odd years - had that permanent trach for 6 years after 5 years of comas and months long stays in the hospital.
Not to mention all the "kids" in my family have asthma and every one of our parents smoked like fiends.
Please keep your smoke to yourself.
Elizabeth

MStuart
01-17-2007, 04:49 PM
Only when your smoke ends up in my lungs.
Peter Julius,
Bryson City, NC

It's okay for "government" to legislate how a business owner (tavern owner, restauranteur) can serve his customers?

Instead of.....the restaurant allows smoking, if that offends you, don't go. Or, the restaurant owner doesn't permit smoking, then I'd need to go to another restaurant.... How 'bout letting the owner of the business, instead of "elected officials" decide how he wants to operate?

Just some food for thought. (I'll be outside burning one as we think on this)

BTW: This "smoking ban" is supposedly good for all of Allegheny County, EXCEPT for the new casino's that are to be built, at least that's what the talk is. Imagine that....

Mark

bizzilizzit
01-17-2007, 05:11 PM
It's okay for "government" to legislate how a business owner (tavern owner, restauranteur) can serve his customers?
Mark

No. Gov should stay out of private business. The owner should decide who his customers should be.

Did you know the Gov is now trying to pass a law making it illegal to smoke in your own home if you have kids - as a form of child abuse.

Big Brother is going too far.

Elizabeth

hanktrent
01-17-2007, 06:00 PM
Best summary of the smoking situation I've read, was somebody who posted that the laws depend on the people's attitude toward something, and society's attitude has changed over the decades.

Concerning smoking, the metaphor that used to apply was, "if you don't want your nose broke, don't step into the ring."

Now it's: "your right to swing your arm ends where my nose begins."

Laws generally follow the norms of society. If the default is smoking, non-smokers either have to choke or leave the group. If the default is non-smoking, smokers either have to wait to smoke or leave the group.

Hank Trent
hanktrent@voyager.net

Trooper Graham
01-17-2007, 06:09 PM
Bringing this thread into CW context (Hark!!!! an accommodation from Sgt Pepper???) smoking was a way of life back then either pipes are charoots. So if it was so "common" how many add that authenticity to their impression?????

Frenchie
01-17-2007, 06:22 PM
There's a limit to how far this smoking ban crap will go. The winky-winky footsie games between the politicians and the tobacco companies are fun until someone loses an election because Big Tobacco didn't pony up the ducats.

Mojo1842
01-17-2007, 11:06 PM
No. Gov should stay out of private business. The owner should decide who his customers should be.

Did you know the Gov is now trying to pass a law making it illegal to smoke in your own home if you have kids - as a form of child abuse.

Big Brother is going too far.

Elizabeth
A couple more interesting thoughts about the smoking ban; if you have a company vehicle or drive a truck for a company, thats considered your workplace also and you can no longer smoke in your workplace. I'd be interested to see how they would look at me considering that for all intents and purposes, I'm self employed. Is my home considered my office? Is my truck considered my workplace?

Ohioreb1861
01-17-2007, 11:11 PM
hey gang,

I chew and I have smokers tell me the spitting is grose, but I can't help that. Atleast the spit isn't harming anyones health. I usually have a cigar at times and smokers tell me to put it out because the smoke and smell bothers them??? sounds Hypocritical dosen't it?:confused:

I voted against the smoking ban here in Ohio because I thought it was a violation of rights. I feel its another way of controlling us. I also don't like how they are making it harder for us to get powder either by raising the
HAZ MAT cost.

Has anyone else found it harder to get black powder? I can't buy it locally anymore for a good price. My unit buys it in bulk to make it cheaper.

Mojo1842
01-17-2007, 11:20 PM
hey gang,


Has anyone else found it harder to get black powder? I can't buy it locally anymore for a good price. My unit buys it in bulk to make it cheaper.
It's been well nigh impossible to find around here for some time; there are only two places to get it near me between the ohio river and dayton.

Part of the problem I think is that there were two smoking related issues on the ballot; one for the total ban and one that would allow owners of businesses to make the decision. Nothing like confusing the voters to get what you want....

Sgt_Pepper
01-17-2007, 11:24 PM
Bringing this thread into CW context (Hark!!!! an accommodation from Sgt Pepper???)

By this point I'm beginning to wonder if I'm being stalked. :???:

Trooper Graham
01-17-2007, 11:47 PM
By this point I'm beginning to wonder if I'm being stalked. :???:

No sgt, far from it....I hear all, see all, read all and....'remember all'. :D and everytime I post something I can't help to remember the time I was politely shown the door for two weeks. I didn't mind really for the cause behind it. Actually it was worth it so don't think you're on my shite list because I actually hold dear to my heart. :D It's just my way showing it. :D

MStuart
01-17-2007, 11:59 PM
On the days when they put the odd, unfortunate rookie with me I'd tell them this: " I smoke...if that offends you, I'll pick you up at the corner of Forbes and Shady at 10:30". Before anyone gets too harsh, I always put my window down. :-)

Mark

Trooper Graham
01-18-2007, 12:01 AM
On the days when they put the odd, unfortunate rookie with me I'd tell them this: " I smoke...if that offends you, I'll pick you up at the corner of Forbes and Shady at 10:30".

Mark

Who's your backup then?

MStuart
01-18-2007, 12:06 AM
We ride a lot of one-man cars.......backup is just a scream away. A few years back when I was working a wagon, I smoked and my other partner chewed Red-Man. It was a regular Tobacco Road. I puffed, he spit.

Mark

Trooper Graham
01-18-2007, 12:25 AM
We ride a lot of one-man cars.......backup is just a scream away. A few years back when I was working a wagon, I smoked and my other partner chewed Red-Man. It was a regular Tobacco Road. I puffed, he spit.

Mark

Somehow the image of..."Car 54 Where are you" comes to mind. :D :D :D

sbl
01-18-2007, 10:13 AM
Elizabeth,

Do you have a source for this?

"Did you know the Gov is now trying to pass a law making it illegal to smoke in your own home if you have kids - as a form of child abuse."

MStuart
01-18-2007, 12:10 PM
Elizabeth,

Do you have a source for this?

"Did you know the Gov is now trying to pass a law making it illegal to smoke in your own home if you have kids - as a form of child abuse."

This might be it, might not........

Mark
----------------------------------
Bangor responds to anti-smoking ban
By BDN Staff
Thursday, January 11, 2007 - Bangor Daily News

By Aaron Smith
Bangor Daily News

BANGOR - The controversial anti-smoking ordinance that city councilors passed on Monday shouldnít put any extra stress on the Bangor Police Department, Chief Don Winslow said Wednesday.

Bangor is believed to be the only city in the nation to adopt an ordinance that prohibits adults from smoking in vehicles in which children under the age of 18 are riding. Violators will be fined $50. It will be considered a primary offense, meaning cars can be stopped by police if illegal smoking is suspected.

"This isnít going to impact us any more than any other ordinance," Winslow said. "Itís just one more thing weíll have to enforce."

Police officers will begin to phase in their enforcement when the ordinance takes effect on Jan. 19, Winslow said. How they enforce it is apt to come under unusual scrutiny from the media.

The Associated Press picked up the story on its nation wire, the Boston Globe, along with other newspapers in the United States reported the story, and several health-related organizations mentioned the news on their Web sites.

As of Wednesday night, more than 100 readers had posted their thoughts about the ordinance on the Bangor Daily News Web site. A majority of the posts appeared to be against the measure because the responders said it infringes on individual freedom.

All the attention hasnít done much to affect Winslowís viewpoint. He said his officers will take a flexible approach to enforcing the smoking ban early on.

"I donít see us taking an aggressive stance," Winslow said. "Initially we will issue warnings and use it as an educational opportunity. Weíre not out to see how many tickets we can get."

Winslow said the only aspect of the ordinance that surprised him was the vote to make it a primary offense.

"I was kind of surprised that the council took that action," he said.

"The councilís decision was based on government intrusion [for] the welfare of a child," Winslow added later.

Winslow said that this ordinance wouldnít specifically target teenagers, as many people think, but the same statewide tobacco possession laws for teens will still be enforced. It is illegal for anyone under the age of 18 to possess tobacco in Maine. Teens can be stopped if it appears they have it in their vehicle, Winslow said.

As for questions of jurisdiction, especially on Interstate 95 in Bangor which is patrolled by State Police, Winslow said he didnít see anything wrong with a Maine State Trooper enforcing the ordinance.

The troopers typically donít enforce town ordinances, Winslow said, but they can also call Bangor police officers when they spot a violator.

Although the City Councilís decision has drawn attention from people who embrace the move, some feel that itís just another case of government infringing on personal freedom.

Amanda Lord, formerly from Bangor, now residing in North Carolina, wrote on Bangornews.com that this was just another unnecessary decision.

"While personal freedom is being restricted more and more, itís a shame that there is a need for a law like this," Lord wrote. "With all the scientific research out these days about the effects of second hand smoke, a reasonable adult should have enough good judgment to not smoke in any enclosed space with a child."

Carry Weston of Bangor also responded to the story on the paperís Web site, but said it was protecting the children who canít stop their parents from smoking.

"Congratulations to the Bangor City Council for taking a positive step towards protecting those that cannot speak on their own behalf ó the children," she wrote.

It might still be too early to tell whether or not the ban will affect local businesses or keep businesses that sell smoking related products from coming to town.

President of the Bangor Region Chamber of Commerce Candy Guerette said that she hasnít had any business owners contact her about the ordinance.

The chamber announced its support of the ordinance in a December newsletter, Guerette said, but the members were still amazed when it passed Monday night.

"We were surprised by the vote because of the primary offense," Guerette said.

It wasnít a surprise, however, that the chamber supported the council because of its Bangor Region Wellness Council, a program that has allowed it to shape the first "well region" in the country Guerette said.

Similar anti-smoking measures have been adopted statewide in Arkansas and Louisiana. Those laws, however, target adults who smoke in the presence of children who are six- to eight-years-old or younger.

Connecticut, Florida, Vermont, Texas and Washington are making efforts to keep adults from lighting up in their vehicles with children as well.
------------------------------------------

I can see it now.....DUI and Anti-Smoking checkpoints. We'll drag you outa your car, and take your kids from you 'cause your abusing them. I can't wait!!! My probable cause to search your entire car will be the ashes on the floorboard, because that's evidence of a crime. This is wide-reaching and will be a big help to law enforcement everywhere!! Of course, you'll still be able to get falling down drunk in front of your kids, and watch as much porn as you can handle in front of them, too. Let's get those priorities straight..........

Mark

bizzilizzit
01-18-2007, 12:38 PM
Elizabeth,

Do you have a source for this?

"Did you know the Gov is now trying to pass a law making it illegal to smoke in your own home if you have kids - as a form of child abuse."

I listen to talk radio all day long - not sure if it was one of my local guys (Columbus, Ohio) or RUSH who was chattering about it a week or two ago. Maybe you can find it in the radio station's archives at WTVN.com.
Elizabeth

sbl
01-18-2007, 02:13 PM
I listen to talk radio all day long - not sure if it was one of my local guys (Columbus, Ohio) or RUSH who was chattering about it a week or two ago. Maybe you can find it in the radio station's archives at WTVN.com.
Elizabeth


Thank's Elizabeth.

sbl
01-18-2007, 02:17 PM
Thank's Mark,

Off topic.....Just found this at the Boston Globe

"Nicotine boost was deliberate, study says
Harvard researchers analyze cigarette data"

http://www.boston.com/news/local/articles/2007/01/18/nicotine_boost_was_deliberate_study_says/

.....sounds like smokers are like wives sticking with the abusive spouse.

MStuart
01-18-2007, 02:23 PM
Thank's Mark,

Off topic.....Just found this at the Boston Globe

"Nicotine boost was deliberate, study says
Harvard researchers analyze cigarette data"

http://www.boston.com/news/local/articles/2007/01/18/nicotine_boost_was_deliberate_study_says/

.....sounds like smokers are like wives sticking with the abusive spouse.

I'll be the first to admit, it's one heckuva habit to break. But that first one in the morning with my coffee? Nirvana!!!!!!!!! :-(

Mark

Marc
01-18-2007, 02:33 PM
A couple more interesting thoughts about the smoking ban; if you have a company vehicle or drive a truck for a company, thats considered your workplace also and you can no longer smoke in your workplace. I'd be interested to see how they would look at me considering that for all intents and purposes, I'm self employed. Is my home considered my office? Is my truck considered my workplace?

I know some truckers and in California your truck is considered your office and a few have been cited and fined. Even though they were at a rest stop and the truck not running.

jademonkey
01-18-2007, 08:05 PM
Bringing this thread into CW context (Hark!!!! an accommodation from Sgt Pepper???) smoking was a way of life back then either pipes are charoots. So if it was so "common" how many add that authenticity to their impression?????

Alright, I'll bite (in the interest of bringing this discussion into the CW). I smoked for years and then gave it up. At night, I would even sneak cigarettes when the other boys went to sleep. Today, I don't smoke cigarettes, at home or at events, but I do smoke a pipe at events. Not only do I find it relaxing during rest breaks or at night before I turn in, but it is also correct for my impression, which is the primary reason I do it. I am not advocating smoking a pipe for the sole purpose of heightening your impression, but it is a nice detail - much like shaving with a straight razor or writing a letter home on period stationary.

tompritchett
01-19-2007, 12:56 AM
I am a smoker, cigars. I fully realize that my smoking indoors can expose those around me to the dangers of second-hand smoke so I do not have a problem with laws that prohibit me from doing so. I haven't been allowed to smoke indoors for years - even in smoking sections, because smoking sections do not apply to cigars and pipes. Where I draw the line however is when you start seeing ordinances such are being considered in California that ban smoking in private cars and outdoor public use areas. On a highway with diesel busses and trucks, the last thing you need to worry about is the miniscule second-hand exposure from my cigar smoke. And do not give me the cancer lecture about smoking when I am driving. I had quit smoking totally but when almost falling asleep multiple times during my daily commute on an Interstate highway that could be doing 80 mph on minute and 35 mph the next in bumper to bumper traffic, I figured that over the long run I was less likely to die from from cancer due to smoking the cigars that kept me awake and alert than from an auto accident because I was not smoking those same cigars. Of course, maybe it was bouncing off a guard rail one evening when driving to my parent's home in Kentucky might have also been a factor in deciding to smoke versus fall asleep at the wheel.