NJ gun laws for non-residents

[David4ovi]

I have looked around for info on this on the boards and have been unsuccessful.

I am an Ohio resident but am in NJ for a few months for job training. I brought my gear with me to go to Bull Run in July. I recently discovered that, as I understand it, you need a permit to carry any gun, regardless of type, in New Jersey. I would get a permit but apparently it takes 12 weeks to get it and by that time I will be back in Ohio.

What I am wondering, am I breaking the law or am I alright as long as I do not "carry" my gun. Also, does this law, as I understand it, preclude me from participating in any NJ reenactments as a walk-on while I am here?

I am hoping some NJ folks can help me out here.

[bizzilizzit]

If I remember correctly, you can transport your weapon as long as the gun is in the backseat and the "bullets" are in the trunk. "Carrying" it at a reenactment doesn't count ;) - no permit needed. BUT, I think you need a permit to OWN a gun - not sure how this works crossing over State lines but "antique" guns are excluded - unless they changed the laws in the past 8 years...
You can "walk-on" in NJ without problems - at least as far as your weapon is concerned.

[Shortround]

There are several work arounds to the law.

1. disassemble your weapon and store the parts seperately. Technically it's not a whole weapon if all the parts are stored seperately.

2. You're asking for trouble if you have blanks and a full weapon in NJ. I would go so far as to buy blanks at the event and assemble my weapon.

3. find a close by "reasonable" state, rent a locker, and store the item there. Lockers are lots cheaper than lawyers.

4. take your chances, store the weapon in the vehicle's trunk, and ignore the fact that NJ has TSA like check points that do occasional searches. If you're expecting protection from the 4th Amendment then get in your time machine and go back before 1990.

A good lawyer will cost no less than $100 an hour (actually up to $200 for better than fair). So, is it worth the price of a locker to rent in a sane state or do you want to follow the advice of point #3 or do you want to pay the cost of a lawyer for 20 hours of work, court costs, and the usual group of legal problems.

Your choice and good luck.

[DamYankee25]

If I remember correctly, you can transport your weapon as long as the gun is in the backseat and the "bullets" are in the trunk. "Carrying" it at a reenactment doesn't count ;) - no permit needed. BUT, I think you need a permit to OWN a gun - not sure how this works crossing over State lines but "antique" guns are excluded - unless they changed the laws in the past 8 years...
You can "walk-on" in NJ without problems - at least as far as your weapon is concerned.

I live in NJ and have my musket with me. They are considered antique and not technically firearms by any standard. If you had an M1 carbine for WWII reenacting or something similar to that you'd have a much bigger problem on you hands. To own a firearm in the state of NJ you need to have a Firearm Purchaser's permit, which is a pain to get sometimes. As my cousin who is a NJ State trooper put it, "Jesus himself couldn't get a concealed weapons permit". But you don't need to worry about that. Keep it in your trunk in the case, keep the black powder separate, if you are really worried, roll your rounds at the event.

And curious, where are these TSA like checkpoints? I've driven all over my fine state and have yet to see one and I live in Hoboken across from Manhattan where the cops carry M4s in the subway.

[agrnbrt]

David, as an NJ LEO with 25 years and getting ready to retire let me fill you in on the simple facts. A musket in NJ IS a firearm. You are from out of state and legally own it where you live. No problem. You need no permit here in NJ to own it. When you transport it to an event just keep it in your case/bag until you get to the event. Keep your blanks in your cartridge box or other type of carrier as you normally would. Since you are re enacting only and live rounds do not come into play, you will have no problems. I hope this helps.

Damnyankee, a couple of notes to you good sir. #1, You stated... "I live in NJ and have my musket with me. They are considered antique and not technically firearms by any standard". Wrong. In NJ black powder muskets, shotguns & revolvers ARE firearms. You need permits to buy any of them.
#2. You stated..."To own a firearm in the state of NJ you need to have a Firearm Purchaser's permit, which is a pain to get sometimes". Wrong, you need a permit to buy, not own.

Shortround, as far as I know, no one with a sound mind transports a musket loaded, so that should not come into play. I take it that you do not know it's illegle to store weapons in storage lockers? If you ever go to one they have it in the contracts under prohibited items. As far as your #4 statement, cut me a break bud. It's NJ, not Stalin's USSR.

[David4ovi]

Thank you agrnbrt, that is exactly what I needed. I was nervous because I had read somewhere that you had to present your state's license but OH doesn't require licenses for muzzleloaders. That might have been for hunting though...

Thanks folks!

[DamYankee25]

Well according to the NJ Laws and Code many of the laws and punishments do not apply to antique firearms and there are several amendments that state "excluding antique firearms or cannon" they are considered antique in accordance with the Federal Law of anything manufactured or reproduced of anything previous to 1898. So says the NJ State Police and NJ legislative codes. I'm seriously asking this question and not being a smarta**, if they are considered firearms why can you not be punished for defacing, etc them?

[RJSamp]

#2. You stated..."To own a firearm in the state of NJ you need to have a Firearm Purchaser's permit, which is a pain to get sometimes". Wrong, you need a permit to buy, not own.



The singular is to the plural, as the plural is to the singular.

Quick, give me a legal definition that spells out that the Purchaser/Buyer is NOT the owner...... so basically you have someone who has the NJ Buyers/purchasers license give you the title to the gun? and you give him money for the title, not the gun, so you aren't actually buying the gun? It's like a gift or something?

Talk about splltting hairs. and an RCH at that.

[hanktrent]

The singular is to the plural, as the plural is to the singular.

Quick, give me a legal definition that spells out that the Purchaser/Buyer is NOT the owner...... so basically you have someone who has the NJ Buyers/purchasers license give you the title to the gun? and you give him money for the title, not the gun, so you aren't actually buying the gun? It's like a gift or something?

Talk about splltting hairs. and an RCH at that.

Agrnbrt's post seemed perfectly clear. He said David already owned his gun as a resident of Ohio, so he didn't need a permit to purchase guns in New Jersey.

It sounds like you need a permit only if you want to buy a gun in New Jersey. But if you already own one, such as David who bought his gun before he came to New Jersey, or presumably if you inherit one, or receive one as a gift, etc., you don't need a purchaser's permit, since you're not purchasing it.

No legaleze, no splitting hairs, no tricks, just a straightforward difference.

Hank Trent
hanktrent@gmail.com

[agrnbrt]

Thank you Hank, it's very easy really. RJ and especially Brandon, feel free to get a copy of NJ 2C.

[DamYankee25]

I did, that is where I pulled the fact that is listed as antique firearm and read the exclusions because they are antique. It's in there pretty clear several times "excluding antique firearms/cannon". Just type in antique weapon/firearm in the searchable database and several things like that come up.

[agrnbrt]

Brandon, first off the post is not about antique weapons. It's about reproductions. Second, get a physical copy of NJ 2C from a FFL holder or the NJSP, not from an online site. Third and final, go try to buy a musket or black powder pistol at a local gunshop in NJ without a firearms id or pistol permit. Let us know how it works out for you.

[DamYankee25]

You put the wrong tone on my posts. Take a deep breath and calm down. Under federal law reproductions fall under antique firearms. But you apparently took this as an attack on you, which it wasn't. I was asking questions to get a better understanding, you put a sarcastic tone on my posts, which was your prerogative.

[Bill_Cross]

Let's all calm down, folks.

As I told my kids, when stopped by a cop, the law is whatever he or she decides it is at that moment. They can put the bracelets on you knowing the charge will be dismissed, but that won't prevent them ruining your day. So always be polite, never snippy and say "yes, Sir," and "no, Ma'am" whenever possible. The local cop has the same right to use deadly force as the highly-trained state police officer, so use caution and keep your nose clean.

First of all, it's **** hard even to FIND a black powder repro in NJ now that Navy Arms closed their retail shop.

As to a firearms ID card, I don't recall them being particularly problematical, but I got mine over a decade ago. It took some time, that's all. The NRA would probably have a their hair catch on fire at the thought of having to wait for something associated with guns, but those of us who live in the People's Republic of NJ seem to survive without instantaneous access to firearms, especially the reproduction variety.

As to black powder pistols, I was able to get a permit to purchase one from my local constabulary, which was what Navy Arms required before they would sell me one many years ago. The cop who handled it all was curious about reenacting and a bit bemused, but couldn't have been nicer. As was stated earlier, a permit to carry a "concealed" pistol is somewhat challenging, but unless you intend to portray John Wilkes Booth, that shouldn't be something you need.

[billwatson2]

People who worry about New Jersey gun laws need to calm down, like Bill Cross said. Even the North Carolinians who were driving around Atlantic City with rifles in the rear window gun rack of their pickup truck got out of the local jail within 24 hours and even got their guns back once a local officer talked to a North Carolina department about the difference in gun laws. I don't think they got any salt water taffy or an apology, but it ended quite well considering they were violating the law. The police and district attorneys in New Jersey aren't fanatics.
The big thing to remember in New Jersey: Case your long gun, even if it's just a canvas sock with a tie strap, and put it away from you. A cased gun is a real good thing to see if you're a police officer, you know you're dealing with someone who is merely transporting, and besides, that's the law. If I'm deer hunting and need to drive 100 yards to a new position, I unload the gun and case the shotgun. A gun not in a case, even an unloaded muzzleloader, triggers all kinds of bad vibrations.
Brandon, what the federal law recognizes as an antique and "not a firearm" is not anything state law is required to take notice of. Besides, if you find yourself arguing that in front of a judge, you already went wrong somewhere. :-)

[Jeffrey Cohen]

Here is the link for the NJ State Police and firearms law:
http://www.state.nj.us/njsp/about/firearms.html
The Volkumer McClure act protects you from going from point A to point B. If you're living in NJ for a while apply for a firearms ID card anyway. You can also voluntarily register your weapon with the local police. Make a photo copy of it to keep with you. You did say musket because pistols will open a big can of worms.
It also won't hurt to check things with the NRA or the Assoc. of NJ Rifle and pistol clubs: http://www.anjrpc.org/