Water system experts?

[Spinster]

Okay, I pretty well know the drill on how to bleach shock and sanitize plastic water jugs or wooden barrels to transport potable water supply, as well as how quickly that water has to be used.

We have several period reproduction tinned 3 gallon milk cans that we also use for water supply, and to carry water for any distance where we need to maintain a period appearance. Much easier than sloshing buckets around.

Using bleach to sanitize these will etch the tin--bad idea on more than one level.

Other than washing these in boiling water, what else can I use that will be effective to sanitize, without etching the tin?

[jda3rd]

Alcohol. Cheap whiskey/rum/vodka/gin of some sort, mixed with a bit of water, slosh it around the inside, making sure the entire inside is wet, then pour it out, rinsing the lid as you do, and let it dry upside-down. It will dry quickly, and while it won't be "sterile", it'll be mighty clean (at least as clean, or more so, than boiling). I don't know if denatured alcohol would work for potable water containers or not. I think it might, as it will be completely evaporated before you store any water in whatever vessel you clean with it. This should work on any surface except wood. It's good with plastic, glass, ceramic, and metal.

Frank Brower
Jeff Davis Artillery

[Dave Myrick]

While admittedly I don't know you would get it but commercial ice machine sanitizer is designed to disinfect soft nickel plated ice machine parts without etching. It is diluted with water and poured over the parts of the ice machine after "cleaning" with a phosphoric acid mixture.

If you cannot get any on your own, let me know. I will get some for you and we will have to work out getting it to you.

Dave Myrick

[RJSamp]

I'd try the alcohol approach.....in fact, how about a nice Milk Punch for those milk containers???

[Spinster]

I'd try the alcohol approach.....in fact, how about a nice Milk Punch for those milk containers???


Now you'd have to talk to a certain surly division sutler about that. He's the one placing food in front of ossifers for a reasonable sum.......

.... reasonable, considering the army is on campaign, and the cost of wagons and teams, and the hostile citizenry, carrying costs for the accounts, spoilage and seepage, manservants, and........

[jda3rd]

Okay, I pretty well know the drill on how to bleach shock and sanitize plastic water jugs or wooden barrels to transport potable water supply, as well as how quickly that water has to be used.



Mrs. Lawson,
Just out of curiosity, how quickly should that water be used? I guess it depends on the weather, and the sort of container, but how long can you safely transport drinking water?

Frank

[Spinster]

It depends .:p

I'm no expert here. What I am, is cautious, especially since we travel with women in their child bearing years, young children, and folks who are immune suppressed. Water quality is vital.

For your typical 6 gallon blue Walmart standard refillable water container, properly bleach shocked and fully rinsed, then refilled with known potable water......

In the South, in the summer, I'm going to start getting nervous about that water in about 24 hours. Does not mean I won't drink it--it does mean I'll start looking at it closely and considering options.

For the same reasons, I'll want to sanitize hoses run to spigots for event water supply.

True safety is a question to be answered by military men with that expertise.

Its really difficult to tell what causes the various grumbly stomachs at events---unfamilar water will set some folks off, simply because it is not their home water. Top that with salt bacon, blue beef, hard cracker and corn meal, and you really have a hoss race. I'll drink water personally that I won't take the responsibility of serving to others, having learned my own stomach in the Far East.

In a hobby where water comes from steel buffalos, ag tanks, fire trucks, hose pipes, running creeks, slow rivers, sudden rainstorms and straight out of the rock---- it pays to ask questions.

[10Tenn]

Ms. Lawson-any brewing store should have a product known as B-Bright-it's a peroxide based cleaner/sanitizer used to sterilize homebrewing carboys and such.

[mexwarbob]

Unless you suspect that the buckets have had contaminated water put in them, you could probably get by with a mild solution of oxi-clean. Then a real good rinsing. The metal should really be resistant to micro growth organism.
If the buckets have had contaminated water in them, then the problem lies with what they were contaminated with and for how long. A solution of water and iodine may do the trick.
Or you could try filling the bucket with clean water and leaving it out in strong sunshine for a few hours. UV radiation can do a lot to sterilize water and hence the buckets. I have done this trick with a clear plastic bottle and some funky water and walked away with no problems.
good luck
Bob Gregory
79th NY
"when i started in reenacting all the drinking water was contaminated with dinosaur spit."

[Cadet]

Alcohol is probably your best and safest sanitizor. I use rubbing alcohol for smaller things (plates, hands, utensils), but it would work for larger things as well. Just be sure to rinse out the alcohol. I'd avoid other types of chemicals, as any residual would end up in your system--which would be bad.

[jda3rd]

I think I'd stick with consumable alcohol (whiskey or whatever) for cleaning water storage vessels, and let them dry without rinsing. To rinse with water would only run the risk of re-contamination. If it's drinking whiskey, it shouldn't leave any chemical behind that we should be worried about. Let the alcohol evaporate, then cork it, put the lid on it, whatever, but keep it closed until use.

In fact, you could potentially rinse several vessels using the same solution, simply pour from one to the next.

You might have to label your "renching" whiskey as such, to keep the bibbers at bay.

Frank

[plankmaker]

Iodine tablets are available at most good hiking outfitters. It is a good sterizing agent and has a retention life much better than alcohol.

[Blair]

Mrs. Lawson,

I agree with you. Using straight household bleach maybe too much for the tinned interior to take. Its non to good on unprotected human skin either.
Have you considered an diluted solution? Say 1/2 once of bleach to a quart of hot water to clean and sterilize the cans. Then rinse with hot water and dry by hand with a clean cloth.
This should not be so strong as to etch the tinned interior plating.
Just an idea,

[Spinster]

Blair,

We are using a dilute solution to sterlize the plastic cans--it does not take that much to do so--do the math, add bleach and water, soak everything including the lids and fill pipes for the requisite time, then rinse very well.

Even lemonade sitting will etch the interior of a good repro hot dip tin pitcher--and I've got the lines in them to prove it. Vinegar, yep--I don't serve switchel or shrub out of tin either.


---------
Yes, we'd love to use the standard iodine tabs. The medical conflict for Type II diabetics makes that a bad idea, for the same reason that we can't have certain dye based medical tests.

I'll be testing both the brewers sanitizer and the rubbing alcohol. It does hurt my heart to think of wasting perfectly good cheap rotgut whiskey :p, evn if I can't drink it. Besides, I've found all these carboys in MyDaddy's basement and all this honey that needs to become mead, so I need that sanitizer anyway. Some of that stuff has been down there since the Cuban Crisis.

[plankmaker]

Alcohol and Type II Diabetes isn't a great combo either. Just saying. There are other halogen products out there as well.

[Spinster]

Yep. Set that jar right down and put the lid on tight.

I can make a wedding cake and never lick the spoon too. :D

Discipline.


We just won't talk about how much I like pig grease,now will we.....

[mexwarbob]

It's not so much what you are going to use to clean and or sterilize but it is what you are trying to get rid of and then the amount of contact time for the agent to do it's job. A lot of nasty critters are amazingly resistant to cleaning and sterilizing agents and need significant contact time to kill them. So whatever you choose make sure it is not just a wipe job. You may have to leave it in the container for a while.

From the antedeluvian days. My original unit the 41st VA had a company in it that was nothing but sailors. In fact our chief of the boat (COB) was our unit NCO. He acquired a wooden barrel that would hold about 20 gallons. This barrel had some green growth inside and although it had come from a winery it had a really bad smell. The ship's corpman; also a member of the unit did not think it was safe to drink from. He made a sterilizing solution which we put in the barrel for a couple of days. Then we put pea gravel in the barrel and some water took turns rolling it around. That got rid of the smell and the nascent swamp that was growing in it. A word of caution to anyone using wooden buckets or barrels, if you get any critters in your water the porous nature of the wood will make it really difficult to keep the water safe.

[Blair]

mexwarbob,

These are all good point.

Porous materials like wood, and in some cases Plastic needs a period of soaking with a suitable disinfecting agent to properly clean them of possible commitments.
One need to be careful with metal containers.
They can clean fairly easily but can't be exposed to many of oxidants commonly used for this proses for any great length of time without those decontaminating/oxidizing agents effecting (etching) the surface of the metals.
Metal containers do not require the soaking to be clean and sterilized.